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Trash Can Thread

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Iggly

Banned
Official Serebii League Suggestion Thread

Ooh la la,


Currently our suggestions thread is being overrun with posts with views on the USL.
So, to keep things clear for everybody and regarding everything.
Please post them here!
Im very much aware that a large number of views have been expressed already.
Yet keeping that thread specifically about the Battle Section, and this one about the league.
Well it just makes life easier for just about everybody =D


Here's a couple of things from the last view pages so we're all on the same page!

I am going to see what I can remember of the USL, unfortunately it seems that a lot of it has been deleted, but I have a decent enough memory, so we'll see what happens. (Is there any chance they could be undeleted? There was a social group, and a thread by Femme addressing the matter, at least. checking the thread history of me, Xyden, HaunterShadow92, FemmeFatale and Blaine's cousin might reveal some interesting threads, if you are interested in digging up deleted threads.) I also have a few bits that I jotted down about a Serebii Tutoring Programme, that I will write down here.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

The United Serebii League

A lot of the most basic ideas are presented in this thread. There is not much there, no illegal hacks, ratios of Gym Leader's Pokemon, and that the champion is not elected.

There was to be a commitee of 5 or 6 people, who were allowed to be Gym Leaders, but were not necessarily, to look after the pastoral side of the league. There would then be 24 "playing staff" and then 1 Champion.

The main things we discussed in the early stages were organisational. We came to an agreement that we would swap at least some of the leaders about once every two months. I remember that we also discussed having two people in charge of each gym, to make sure that they were as active as possible, and if a leader needed to take a break the other could step in. I really like this idea, because it means that, when one person leaves, they can leave their gym to the other person, who can then take charge of "hiring" another gym leader and ensure that the change-over goes as smoothly as possible. People should probably have to battle either one gym leader, or the other to get the badge, not both.

As for the format, in the end, we decided that the standard format would be used, there would be 8 Gym Leaders, who were selected by a process (to be outlined later) and Four Elite Four, who were also selected. The champions position would only be filled when somebody beat the Gym Leaders (I think I was for only having to beat ~6 leaders, although other were all for having to beat all 8) and then the Elite 4. the Gym Leaders could be challenged in any order. I think that the Elite Four should also be allowed in any order (simply because of timing, challenging on order is too awkward) others were for challenging them in order. If the champion is beaten, the new champion takes his place (if he wishes to, of course).

A few other tidbits were decided, a lot of time was spent of creating a "rules" and almost introductory guide to the league, so that people knew all of the details of how it was run, and how they should go about challenging (if we could dig this up, that would be fantastic. It is most likely in the deleted social group) You had to wait 3 or 4 days before re-challenging a Gym Leader.

There was a lot of stuff on how we would hire / rotate Gym leaders, and how the thread would be laid out (for example, should each Gym leader have his own thread?) There hiring process involved a simple questionaaire, that determined whether the leader got a practice battle and then if they passed that, the remaining candidates got an interview type battle, to see how tought they were. The questionaaire was no joke, does anyone have one saved in their PM boxes, or something? One did not necessarily need to win the battle, either, just to prove that they were competant. There was to be no restrictions on what types the Gym-Leaders had to be, although it was agreed that no two gym leaders should have the same type, and no two Elite Four should have the same type either. The Gyms types would be decided by the types of the eight best candidates, and then another candidate for that type would be selected from the pool, the same goes for the Elite Four.

OK, that's all I can remember for now. I'm sure that there is more information locked up in my head, so please throw questions at me, and I may well be able to tell you what we agreed on, and then maybe a few ideas, if nothing was agreed on!

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Serebii Tutoring Programme

I'll update the post with this later, I've typed a lot already!

Goldfan. You basically said everything I could remember. Only just that the commitee took like a group of 15 or so applicants and tested them to see if they were worthy.

I wouldn't start the USL seeing as you will need a comitee first, which I would gladly still be a part of, in order to get EVERYTHING straight first. The most important thing about this league is that it wwould be the official league, thus it would have to be presented it the nicest and simplest way possible. It would be best to choose the commitee first, start a chat room, and then through PMs and everything share set-ups until you get the perfect set-up and THEN submit it. You don't want to start something unfinished. It needs to be READY for signups the moment it is posted. There will definatly be a high demand for positions and the longer you wait to get a crew to test them, the less the interest. I suggest to setting up the commitee first and then together decide who will be the overall leader, which I would assume would be you since you are taking this pretty muh right now as a leader, and then decide who does what.

From what I remember there were 7 positions in the commitee. These could be totally wrong but this is what I remember:
-Overall Leader
-Co-Leader
-Gym Manager (Keeps track of activity, makes sure gyms are accepting challenges, etc.)
-Tester (Everyone can test, but these are who the applicants come to first)
-Tester(" ")
-I can't remember the others unfortunatly.

EDIT: Oh and on the tutoring thing. There isn't really much to say is there? Just: A bunch of people sing up to be tutors, activity is key AND so on and so forth.

EDIT2: Also, I think Goldfan hit it right on the head with Gyms being seperate threads. In that case, the USL should be a new sub-section, and if at all possible, the comitte should be the only mods there (don't read as mods of the entire 4th gen sction, just the one sub-section). This way the committee knopws all of the rules and won't have to bother other mods to close threads and such.

Hello All!

I just got back from a long break away, and I heard the USL was trying to be restarted. As one of the Committee members of the Original USL, I worked Closely with Goldfan, Femme, Haunt, and Blaine. I also kept records of all discussions i had about it, both Public and Private. I have them saved on a few flash drives which i will locate and post later today seeing that it is 1:50 in the morning here and i need to be in work at 8. (in just a few hours).

I want to be a part of this at an Coordinator Level. Seeing that My talents are there, it would be something that I would be dedicated to. The USL was a pillar that had to be built and after it was put on the back burner, i kept all my files in case this happened.

Till later,

Don

EDIT:

So I have been reading the Thread a bit more in depth, and I want to address some things.

The USL: Goldfan did a wonderful job explaining it. If my memory Serves me it was similar, if not exactly the way he wrote it up. As to the layout of the League, I think that it should be set up like Regileague. Like mentioned before, Make it Serebii's Official League. That way you can make a Section devoted to the league itself and subsections for each of the gyms and E4 members. On these subsections, there could be a thread for asking for challenges, people who won, and so on. The RegiLeague format has been extremely successful. I would also suggest that you make a c-box that is dedicated and run by those in the league itself. I also suggest that you mod new mods to look after the Section. Instead of bringing in Mods like Erik, Volt, and Ellie (who most likely not have a hands on approach as I, goldfan, or haunt would) it would be better to mod new people (like ones just mentioned) just to mod over that ONE section. This way things can get done faster and simpler. Only those who seem dedicated should be the ones to have that respect and responsibility.

Here is a rough Draft of what we can have the section set up like: (Sections are Bolded, Subsections have indent & -)
United Serebii League
League Information
-Information/History of League (General Info)
-Official Staff/Roster
-Official Rules of League
-League Admin Thread
-League Admin Thread
Gym Leaders
-Gym Leader 1 Thread
-Gym Leader 2 Thread
-Gym Leader 3 Thread
-Gym Leader 4 Thread
-Gym Leader 5 Thread
-Gym Leader 6 Thread
-Gym Leader 7 Thread
-Gym Leader 8 Thread
-Gym Leader LeaderBoard (Hall of Fame for Gyms)
Elite 4
-E4 Member 1 Thread
-E4 Member 2 Thread
-E4 member 3 Thread
-E4 Member 4 Thread
-Champion Thread

This System is our best bet. The rules about the League can be amended at any time. We should also get the USL up and running ASAP! We wait long and it could be deadlocked! Oh another thing.... If the USL is created, I think all other Leagues should be allowed stay open, but with a restriction. Only one other League (at one time) should be allowed. This allows for different types of leagues to be opened. the

The Clan Section: I think it should be reworked. Like said before me, have tougher restrictions. Before the Clan is approved, prehaps the prospective Leader has to get 10+ members to agree to be regular members. If no activity is seen (and I mean productive activity) for a few days, it gets shut down. Perhaps only allow 4 Clans at once? The section needs to be saved...fast....

Anyway thats it for me...for now.... I hope some good can come out of this and I look forward till later! LONG LIVE THE USL!

~Don

I don't think that an entire section devoted to the USL is necessary. I think that we should try to run it in one thread, although perhaps a sub-forum would be useful. We certainly don't need separate sections for Gym Leaders / Elite Four, that would just be a waste, and would completely "take over" the Battle forum, when there are a lot of other sections that also deserve attention. I also don't want to draw comparisons to the RegiLeague, I'd like to think we can work on this separately, perhaps taking small influences from elsewhere, but not completely modelling ourselves off something else. As I have already said, I don't think that modding will be necessary. Also, I wouldn't assume you are actually working on it yet, the mods are also discussing these ideas and it is them that will make the final choices, we are simply giving them ideas (hopefully :) )

EDIT: Is that the exact Questionnaire? I only remember it being 10 questions, it wasn't like that at all =/. Anyway, that is not what I would want the questionnarie to be like entirely, I would want it to focus on battling a lot more, and less on administrative questions. Additionally, it is too long, Questions such as "How many battles have you won / lost are easy to doctor, lie about. I wouldn't know how many I won / lost anyway! A lot of questions also have very similar answers. I will post an outline of the sort of thing I would want in a bit. Of course, I will use some of the questions you provided ;)

I think first we would have an Application for that would ask some necessary details. This would be posted in the thread, and would be more administrative, not testing skills. Some questions would obviously want some battling background but not a huge amount:

1.) Are you applying for the position of Gym leader or Elite Four?
2.) What type do you wish to use in your position?
3.) What former battling experience do you have?
4.) What timezone are you in?
5.) Explain breifly why you are fit for this job?

I don't expect this to weed out many applicants, but those with little experience should be fairly obvious. Those who pass this very easy test would then go on the Battling Questionnaire. The battling questionnarie should get right to the point, in my opinion. 5 medium answer questions or so, I think, will do the trick. This will weed out the better battlers, so that we are only having to battle a minimum of competant people, If you see what I mean. Something like this might do the trick:

1.) Is your mono-team built yet? If so, explain how it works, and why you built it that way. If not, explain your ideas and how you intend to build your team. Try to include especially, precautions that you might need to take when facing normally-built teams.
2.) Say Pokemon x was take out of the metagame, how do you think it would change?
3.) What type of team do you usually play with? Explain your preference. (Note that this question refers to types of standard team such as Stall and other types, rather than gimmik-themed teams, such as Regional or mono-type teams)
4.) What UU or NU Pokemon would you like to see an evolution of, and explain your choice. (Please stick to competitive reasoning as much as possible)
5.) Explain more fully your battling experience.

This is obviously just a sample. Question 1 is designed to test a person's aptitude with mono-type teams. I would want to them to explain breifly about covering weaknesses, but also about ensuring that you have at least one game plan. That is what DPP is all about, after all. Question 2 test a players understanding of the metagame, nad the influences on Pokemon has on another, this is very important for mono-type teams, as you have a much smaller pool of Pokemon to experiement with. Question 3 should test general competance, it should become obvious if a player is a good battler from the answer that they give to this question. Question 4 is a lighter Question, but still tests a candidates knowledge of the metagame, and will help to gauge their playing style. Finally Question 5 is just looking for a little more of the history behind the player.

Now that I think about it, a whole section might be overkill, but a subsection is needed no doubt. Prehaps have this to make it more condensed:
United Serebii League
-General Information & Rules
-Official Staff & Leader Roster
-Admin's Thread (for people to discuss ideas and what not)
-Gym Leader & E4 Thread (have the 13 first posts reserved for bios & information of the leaders. The rest of the thread can be for asking for battles and what not)
-Hall of Fame

This would make the league more compact. It's not a waste, trust me, if its not needed, then delete it, but i have a feeling that what I mentioned above is needed. Now I was thinking of the Committee. If set up, I think that it should be 5 not 7+ people. 5 is a good small number. if you have too many people, it might get a bit confusing.

Also, Gold, you said that you are against Modding. I am too if alot of people are modded. Like i said before, all Sections need to be modded sooner or later, and what i suggested was that someone like you or me who will be working on it hard should be Mods for that one section. That way, it cuts out the middleman. If you constantly had to have Erik Change a post, it would get annoying for you and him wouldnt it? By having one or two for that section only, things would get done faster.

As to the questionnaire, i was mistaken. that was my rough draft i sent Femme. she changed it alot. Sorry bout that! Well got to run!

~Don


NOTE: Me posting this here DOES NOT mean we're creating the USL already (or at all).
This is simply to express everybodies views regarding this, and look at its (dis)advantages.
Keep it clean, on topic and try to be as constructive as you can.
Just bcos you dont agree with someone doesnt mean he's wrong.

Happy suggesting! ;P

Iggz
 

ellie

Δ
Staff member
Admin
Before this thread is underway, I have a few concerns I want to address that I'd like those interested in a USL to answer:

-Who would run the league?

-How would the choosing of leaders be completely fair and unbiased?

-What would happen if the leaders got banned and/or behaved in a way that badly represented the site?

Go.
 

DonDemio

Maverick of Serebii!
So like I mentioned in the "Improvements to Serebii Battle Thinger McBober" (I cant remember the exact name) there could be a Prize Exchange Corner that is made in conjunction with the USL. The one that i already posted on the other thread would be to difficult to manage. This one would be smaller and easier to handle. Here is the rundown.

Like I mentioned before, there would be a Battle Frontier Style point system. Each Victory in the League gains you points. You beat a Gym Leader? Bam, Points! You made it to the E4? Bam, Points! You can then go to the "Corner" and exchange those points for various prizes that include Pokemon, items, tms (the list goes on) I could supply most, but the good stuff would come from private donations. The rates would be good, so it would promote activity and gain more challengers. Some gyms might have bad prizes (We cant help that) so it would bring more meaning to the League.

Prehaps we can bring the Platinum Exchange Corner to the table. Add a few games that people can play and it might just drum up more business. There could also be other events to give out points too.

On to other things. I think that if it goes through, other leagues should close. Having six to ten leagues plus The USL might lower the chances of the USL to be successful. My understanding is that we want the USL to be highly popular and successful that it rejuvenates the battle forums. By having other leagues, that chance fades. I know this would upset some League owners, but perhaps we can incorporate their leagues into the USL? An example you might ask? Of the USL's Gyms would be the "Theme Gym" Gym Leaders from the Theme League could run that gym. I'm just throwing the idea around, so work with it. (or don't)

Gold, I don't know if you mentioned this here already, but the Gym Leaders and e4 positions would be application based. Prehaps a one on one interview with a committee member would be nice. Also, We should create a Xat-box or a (Serebii Chat) if the league is in fact opened up. They are extremely easy to use and allows people to find leaders quicker.

Thats all I have for now. Read and communicate. All said above were ideas!

~Don

EDIT FOR ELLIE:
Before this thread is underway, I have a few concerns I want to address that I'd like those interested in a USL to answer: Gold Correct me if i'm mistaken!

-Who would run the league?
The league would be managed by a Committee of 5 members. These members would conduct the interviews and application process of the League. A moderator or two would be subject to membership on the Committee. This Committee would oversee the daily going on of the League and deal with all aspects of rules and management. Current Moderators would make sure posts and stuff are clean.

-How would the choosing of leaders be completely fair and unbiased?
Erm, from what I can tell, Goldfan is the presumed leader of the USL. He revived talks. I guess he wants to interview people with the mods for selection of the committee. By having the mods help him, it would be completely fair. I think we all know, by the time it is made, who is really in it for power, or who worked to make it happen. The application process does away with nepotism. He could answer better than I could, but I think I got the gist.

-What would happen if the leaders got banned and/or behaved in a way that badly represented the site?
If one leader got banned, which wont happen, i guess a public statement would be made and life would go on. The banned leader would be replaced. One persons actions should not tarnish a high respected League. All the Committee members would be respected and behaved members of the forums. I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Hope this Helped!
Go.
 
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goldfan

playing an ish game
Before this thread is underway, I have a few concerns I want to address that I'd like those interested in a USL to answer:

-Who would run the league?

-How would the choosing of leaders be completely fair and unbiased?

-What would happen if the leaders got banned and/or behaved in a way that badly represented the site?

Go.

I'll answer these myself and then see if they match up with Don's ;)

As for who would run the league. I would hope for a panel of about 5 people that would run the league, each one would probably have individual assigned tasks, or areas of the league to look after, but they would all be dedicated and prepared to work hard for the league. I would hope that there would be enough interest amongst moderators to include at least two of them on this panel, to handle administrative things that you would need moderation powers to handle such as updates to the OP of the main (or only) thread and dealing with those who break the rules. People will be allowed to apply to the panel, I would want them to fill in a form and then have an interview conducted on the chat, or something along those lines to try to find the most intelligant and dedicated users for the job. I assume that those moderators who are interested would handle the selection process, as only they have already proven themselves. I can provide a little more info on what roles the panel would have to play, but I feel this gives a decent overview, do ask if you want to know any more details!

It's hard to get a completely unbiased process, all of the people on this forum are human, and not particularly experience with such processes (myself included). Anyway, I would hope to have a three tier process which included a very basic application from, then a more intense, battle focused questionnaire (for examples of both, see the OP). Those that aren't totally unsuitable (filtered out by the original application) and inexperienced (filtered out by the Questionnaire) will then have a test battle. You would not necessarily have to win the test battle, it would be a more subjective evaluation of the players ability. Unfortunately, there is no way of avoiding the subjectiveness of the Questionnaire evaluation and the test battle evaluation, so some sort of standardising process might have to be included (not really sure quite how this would work yet, perhaps someone could post some examples first?) The application handling team would be the panel, with one chief application manager who oversees and hopefully helps out with standardising and the rest who follow his lead but do slightly more of the grunt work.

Hopefully, the application process would filter out those individuals who are likely to display such behaviour. But, should such a situation arise, I would expect that the moderators would be able to carry out their standard duties in giving out infractions and the necessary banning. We will make sure that it is in the rules or guidelines of the league that competitors should report any foul play from leaders or challengers, should such a less detectable display of unproffesional behaviour occur. The panel will handle any such complaints with due care and attention to decide what appropriate action to take for conduct that is outside the rules of the league. As for hiring a new leader, there will be an application process that will be started by the second leader of that specific Gym (I have mentioned already that it would be easier if each gym had two leaders), he would handle the applications and then the panel would handle the questionnaire and the test battle as before.

I hope those answered any questions that you might have. If you still have any concerns, please keep asking!
 

J.T.

ಠ_ಠ
A few things about the point system.

I think it's a good idea, but like people have said, there would likely be some problems keeping track of how many everyone has. I can think of a few ideas to keep track more easily.

First, someone would need to be put on the committee for the purpose of keeping track of points. Gym leaders, Elite Four members, and the Champion will have to inform the point tracker whenever they are beaten, and the tracker would change that person's point count accordingly. How that would happen depends.

I don't know how these forums work, seeing as I've never run one or been a moderator on one, but if there's a way a moderator can edit a value on another person's User Profile - under About Me or Statistics, for example - the points could be listed there, and updated whenever possible.

If that wouldn't work, it's possible we could just have a whole thread dedicated to keeping track of points that members have accumulated, similar to the "Claim a Pokemon" thread. A list of names will go down in alphabetical order, and anyone who has above zero points' name will be listed along with the amount they have. The list could be put in separate spoiler tags to shorten the list and make it easier to find your own name. Again, this list would be updated whenever the point tracker is able.

The first option is a bigger pain to go through, but it's easier to check your own points, and probably a good bit more secure. The second one's easier to maintain, but it's a bit messier. I don't know how either of those work in practice, but they sound okay, so they could work until someone comes up with a better idea.

Another thing. Would people fight the Gym Leaders and Elite Four in any order they want, or would they have to battle them in order? I understand you need to beat all the Gym Leaders to get to the Elite Four. If you have to go in order, then I have an idea for the Gym Leaders/E4 to get a bit of competition going between each other, too. A Gym Leader on a lower level than the one above them may challenge the one directly above them; if they win, they switch tier levels with the other. If one reaches the top of the gym list, they could challenge the first Elite Four member; if they win, they become an E4 member, and the loser goes down to the gym level.

I do see a problem arising when a gym leader runs into one for whom they have a serious type disadvantage (for example, Water against Electric), or for when an Elite Four member (whom it seems will have a 4:2 ratio of their chosen type specialization to other types) drops down into the gym level (which has a 5:1 ratio by the sounds of it); as well, if you're allowed to do the gyms in any order, this whole idea is rather moot. It's a thought, though, and I'm sure we could think of a solution if others think this is a good idea.

Just my two cents. Or in this case, dollars.
 
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goldfan

playing an ish game
Another thing. Would people fight the Gym Leaders and Elite Four in any order they want, or would they have to battle them in order? I understand you need to beat all the Gym Leaders to get to the Elite Four.

Although I do understand that it would be cool to have a Gym leader ranking system, I really feel that challenging the Gym leaders or the Elite Four in an order will put too much pressure on the lower ones and too little pressure on the higher ones. It just wouldn't work, imagine being Gym leader 1, being constantly bombarded with PMs from eager challengers, whilst the others have to wait for ages even to get one challenger. No, for the sake of the leaders and the challengers, the Gym leaders should not be challenged in order. As for the Elite Four, less peoplpe will get through to challenge them, but I still feel that challenging them in order would be too much hassle, and they should also be challenged in a random order.

As for the points system, I can't help but feel like it's a step a little too far, perhaps just a little too hard to manage. Of course, if people are willing to organise it then sure, give it a go! But, I feel that one prize per gym will be sufficient, each prize should be reasonably good, perhaps one UT IV bred Pokemon of that type.
 

Hauntershadow92

The Mono-type Man
-What would happen if the leaders got banned and/or behaved in a way that badly represented the site?

Go.
The other questions were answered better than I could have spoken and I have nothing else to add to their answers. However, I do have something to add to this answer, and if someone covered this already and I missed it, I apologise.

I'm pretty sure Don, Gold and I, while not officially, discussed having 2 Gym Leaders per Gym. Not only will this curb the inactivity that may occur, but if a Leader does infact gets banned or acts very poorly we have a 2nd Gym Leader to back up until we get another back up leader. Both leaders are able to take challenges and give out badges. I'm sure we will get many many applicants, so those who aren't chosen can be placed on a reserved list and if we so happen need a new Gym Leader we can contact these people. The list would be in order as to who PM the application first, so its more of a first come first serve.

In a somewhat related thought, in the application I think 3 types should be listed. Their main type, second type and backup type. Main type will be the one that we will try and get if they are chosen, and if not we then go down the line. This way, the people on the reserve list have a better chance of taking over a gym when it becomes their chance. These reserved people could also pass over their chance if the Gym type is not their type. This would be fine and they would just be first on the list next time.

Advantages for this league:
I haven't really seen any of us discuss the advantages of this league so let me explain. First of all, as many people already know, leagues die VERY fast here on Serebii. I'm pretty sure there is only one longer lasting league 9that being the theme league). Every other league ends up dieing after like 2 weeks beacause the leaders aren't active (Teams aren't made whent eh League is made, rather during the league) and activity in the challengers is low (Challengers also don't have their teams ready.). This league, with the dual leader, replacement leader, set-up will curb the low activity in the leader section, and the sign ups in the begging (application process for leaders) will give challengers PLENTY of time to get ready. Secondly, instead of the general league who asks anyone to be a leader, this league provides the upmost challenge for everyone, seeing as there will be an intensive application process.

The only downside to this league is that other leagues will basically become obsolete. Like many have already suggested I say we keep the Theme League alive and running. People may want a break from the norm and the theme league provides a nice fun way to battle. Other leagues, unless I'm missing a few, are basically repititous to the USL. I say we keep at most 2 extra, DIFFERENT STYLED, leagues.

/end rant.

Oh and
I do see a problem arising when a gym leader runs into one for whom they have a serious type disadvantage (for example, Water against Electric), or for when an Elite Four member (whom it seems will have a 4:2 ratio of their chosen type specialization to other types) drops down into the gym level (which has a 5:1 ratio by the sounds of it); as well, if you're allowed to do the gyms in any order, this whole idea is rather moot. It's a thought, though, and I'm sure we could think of a solution if others think this is a good idea.

There will be (with aggreement witht he commitee) a rule against counter teams. Leaders would report the team and the challengers win will be nulled and he will be suspended from challenging for a day or so after the amount days he would have to normally wait. In addition Leaders should be allowed to be challenged at any point, not in order.
 

J.T.

ಠ_ಠ
That's a good point about the gym leader challenges; I hadn't really thought about that. It's probably best to stick with going in any order you want.

As for prizes. Maybe there could be three prizes available. One for beating every gym leader, one for beating every E4 member, and one for beating the Champion. You could get points from winning against separate gym leaders/E4 members as well.

I think there'd be a few people, myself included, who would be willing to work on the point system.
 
There will be (with aggreement witht he commitee) a rule against counter teams. Leaders would report the team and the challengers win will be nulled and he will be suspended from challenging for a day or so after the amount days he would have to normally wait. In addition Leaders should be allowed to be challenged at any point, not in order.

I just want to ask why we would start adding rules and restrictions for challenger's teams when we could just set a lower type ratio?

It gives the leader more options for teams, thus making it more enjoyable for them, and also makes the league harder to conquer, which will make the title of champion all the more prestigous.

As for the idea of having 2 GLs for each gym, that would give us what, 20 league staff that battle alone? I'm just not sure that we have enough battlers at this moment in time that are of the quality of what is needed. And let's not forget we need some left over that can challenge it too. Personally, I think it would be best to leave this idea for now but think about it in the future when the league has attracted enough good battlers to Serebii (since that is one of the main advantages of the league).

Just my opinions.
 

Hauntershadow92

The Mono-type Man
How will the league attract people if there is no league?
 

goldfan

playing an ish game
I don't like the 3:3 type ratio for Elite Four members, whilst it is possible, it seems a little too watered-down for a position such as that. The reason that I would prefer a small restriction on a challengers team is because of this description of the restriction: The restriction should only be a bother to those who are trying to play around the Gym leader's type, for those who are simply playing a normal team, it should provide little or no barrier to playing their normal (and possibly best) team. So in a way, the restriction should encourage people to play a sensible team against all Gym leaders, rather than breed 3 or 4 Pokemon specifically for each leader (which the eager challenger might be encouraged to hack). This is a benefit to the league, rather than a hindrance to the challenger. Secondly, we need the Gym badges to be accesible, it needs to be a challenge, but having to beat the top 8 battlers on Serebii with only a little significant advantage is perhaps too hard.

As for your second point, I feel you may be right and that may have been a large oversight on my part. I was basing my thoughts on my observations of the last attempt to set up the USL, which was very popular. Perhaps you are right, and that it would be better to set up the USL with 1 Gym leader planned to start with, and then if interest is high enough we could consider adding a second. I feel that the advantages of having two Gym Leaders are desirable, but it may not be feasable at this point in time. Thanks for bringing that up.
 

DonDemio

Maverick of Serebii!
In response to J.T., I think that the point system would be included into the main thread. Prehaps the tread could be set up like this: The first post from OP would include the official rules and League info (Gym leaders and and that stuff). The Second Post would be for the League's Exchange Corner. With all the needed info in the initial Post, the second post would be a perfect spot. If the mods can change who posted what (like if i posted this message, the mods can go in and change it to say that Goldfan posted it. This allows him to get editing rights) then a Committee member would be the poster. This one Committee member would oversee the Exchange Corner and make sure that it is stocked, the point values are correct and do all necessary trades. With the gym leaders reporting wins, it would be easy to track.

As to the roles of the Committee Members, I think it is agreed that there will be 5 Members. Just for idea purposes Lets call them the United Serebii League Executive Committee (USLEC). The USLEC would have to have a group to discuss regular happenings and should meet about once a week in a chat. (due to timezones, this might be hard, but it could work if people are willing to stay up) For the roles and Powers of the USLEC, I'm thinking: (names subject to change)

1) Director of the USL: Serves as the chief Administrator for the League. Cast votes in matters only if a tie is present. Has power to veto measures. (but other USLEC members can veto his veto by a 3-2 vote) Is the OP for the thread. Nominates USLEC members if a vacancy is present. (The other USLEC members must approve by a 3-2 vote) The leader of the application process for the selection of League Leaders. Main contact for the League.
2)Deputy Director of the USL: Serves as second official Administrator of the League. When the Director is not present, is the Head of the League. Regular voting member of the USLEC.
3)Chief of Leader Relations: Serves as the Administrator to Gym Leaders, E4 members, and Champion. Makes sure that the Leaders are ready to battle and oversees Gym and E4 activity. Any Complaints about Leaders will be made to the Chief of Leader Relations. If seen fit, the Chief may deal with the report himself, or bring it forward to the USLEC for a hearing. Regular voting member of the USLEC.
4)Chief of Challenger Relations: Serves as the Administrator to all Challengers. Makes sure that all the challengers are behaving and answers all questions that they may have. If a leader finds one to be troublesome or shady, then the Chief may deal with the report himself or bring it forward to the USLEC for a hearing. Also serves as main tester for application process for the selection of League Leaders. Regular voting member of the USLEC.
5)Chief Clerk/Purser: Serves as the main secretary of the League. Is responsible for saving all important documents regarding the League. As Head Purser, oversees the management of the League’s Exchange Corner. Responsible in overseeing the Exchange Corner and make sure that it is stocked, the point values are correct. Must also do all necessary trades. Regular voting member of the USLEC.

The above jobs are just a starting point. I think we need to decide this sooner or later. Each USLEC member should have a major responsibility. As to Gym Leaders, having two would be a good system. Of course, we would have to decide if a challenger could face one or the two to win the badge or not. Prehaps if a challenger wins against one, they move on to the 2nd to win the badge. But like Dan said. Having 16 GL might be hard right now. Perhaps we can have 8 right now and then get the backups as time goes on. I think what we should get away from is having people sign up to be the 2nd gym leaders. One is fine to start with. As to the Point system, I am currently coming up with an exchange. I would love to spearhead that project.

~Don
 

phop

(D)
I've heard alot about having numerous Gym leaders for each position, points systems, etc. I would like to see 1 Gym Leader and a student for each position (Student would be optional but recommended and the Gym leader would appoint). The Gym leader would be responable for all the battles and the student would be there incase of inactivity issues, or if the Gym Leader feels he is capable of doing a few battles for himself. This would ease the possible backlog of battle requests.

Also I feel we should stick to the anime Gym leader system, where their are no restrictions on challenging them in order. This would relive stress on certain Gym members. The Elite 4 should however should be challenged in order, simply because it mimics the anime system and The Elite 4 won't be challenged very often so stress issues wouldn't be a issue.

As for the point system; I feel this is destined to fail simply because it does involve massive amounts of work to mantain such a demanding job and is greatly underappreciated and will, whoever manages it, lose interest in it after a while (I know from my dealings with my clan) I feel we stick to a simple Gym badge to victors because it does represent more than anything you could buy. A sticky would have to be opened to keep track of members Gym badge count, but this is much easier to manage.

Now onto Ellie's questionaire;

-Who would run the league?

I totally agree with the above thoughts about a 5 member team. But the right people have to be appointed and they are a given really, because to my knowledge, about that number have been discussing the idea. I feel if these people were appointed, their would be no complaints from anyone.

-How would the choosing of leaders be completely fair and unbiased?

I feel a good 10 are already a given but to bring a fairity to the system, an application form, a test battle and the nessasary background checks would be required. I would like to see Iggly as head of appointments, simply because he's active and I feel has matured as a person since being elected as Mod and has the best idea who to appoint because, sorry if I'm wrong, others have been inactive for a while or don't socialize with the other parts of the Battle Forum so their appointments might be outdated or biased.

-What would happen if the leaders got banned and/or behaved in a way that badly represented the site?

I feel this wouldn't be an issue. When people are entrusted with responability they seem to mature and stand up to their status. Iggly is a fine example of this, no offence xD. But if these issues would arise, I feel they should face our current system of infractions and with the possibility of losing their position in the league.
 
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I don't like the 3:3 type ratio for Elite Four members, whilst it is possible, it seems a little too watered-down for a position such as that. The reason that I would prefer a small restriction on a challengers team is because of this description of the restriction: The restriction should only be a bother to those who are trying to play around the Gym leader's type, for those who are simply playing a normal team, it should provide little or no barrier to playing their normal (and possibly best) team. So in a way, the restriction should encourage people to play a sensible team against all Gym leaders, rather than breed 3 or 4 Pokemon specifically for each leader (which the eager challenger might be encouraged to hack). This is a benefit to the league, rather than a hindrance to the challenger. Secondly, we need the Gym badges to be accesible, it needs to be a challenge, but having to beat the top 8 battlers on Serebii with only a little significant advantage is perhaps too hard.

Well, first of all, it may not even be the best 12 on Serebii. I would imagine at least one or two of them would rather challenge for whatever reason. Secondly, in order to not beat someone after several attempts there will more than likely have to be a rather large gap in ability, in which case, I would think they'd need to get better before they can actually become champion. I really don't think it would be as hard to do as you are implying to beat these battlers just once when they have the freedom of lower type ratios. It might take a while but that just shows to everyone that it's a great feat to have achieved. Besides I'd much rather be able to say "I beat the best of Serebii in the USL" rather than "I beat the best of Serebii when their teams were restricted and I had the advantage".

Either way this would definately be something that this commitee would have to vote upon (or even the GLs and E4 once they are picked since it affects them more than anyone).

As for your second point, I feel you may be right and that may have been a large oversight on my part. I was basing my thoughts on my observations of the last attempt to set up the USL, which was very popular. Perhaps you are right, and that it would be better to set up the USL with 1 Gym leader planned to start with, and then if interest is high enough we could consider adding a second. I feel that the advantages of having two Gym Leaders are desirable, but it may not be feasable at this point in time. Thanks for bringing that up

Yeah. Who knows, down the line we may even realise, providing we pick the right people, that we don't have enough activity problems to be worth bothering about extra GLs anyway. Definately something to keep in mind for when the league has grown though.
 

DonDemio

Maverick of Serebii!
As for the point system; I feel this is destined to fail simply because it does involve massive amounts of work to maintain such a demanding job and is greatly unappreciated and will, whoever manages it, lose interest in it after a while (I know from my dealings with my clan) I feel we stick to a simple Gym badge to victors because it does represent more than anything you could buy. A sticky would have to be opened to keep track of members Gym badge count, but this is much easier to manage.
I see where you are coming from, and i agree to some extent. While it seems like a massive amount of work, it really isnt. The basis is this. A victory in the league earns you points. In the beginning, it would only be limited. The only way to earn points is by defeating a leader, e4 member or the Champion. the set amount will be decided. What makes it so simple is that when a leader, e4 member or the Champion looses. they PM the Committee member who would be running the Corner. The Committee members would then update the post to include the points. Also, this Committee member would be the one conducting the trades for the prizes. That makes it simple to deduct points. Its rather simple if you think about it.

I'm playing devil's advocate right now, so don't take this the wrong way. Some people (like me) enjoy running things like this. If a dedicated person is running it, it wont fail. I think it is a good idea because like i said before. I will give people something to show for their battles. The items will always be a reminder of their feats. Also, it could help them improve their battling skills. Also, the badges. I know that they are special, but i think it would be better to say to people, "Hey look I got this Ultra rare Legendary for beating Serebii's league." This might not mean anything to us oldies, but to a newer battler, it means more than a link to a badge. A badge is proud to display, but to use a pokemon that you trained hard for is even better in my opinion. Its like i always say. My favorite pokemon in the games is my Latios. I trained him all the way to 100 by battling. Proudest moment in my life! I wouldnt feel great if i did all that work and all i got to show for it was a badge!

Like i'm saying now. Give it a try. If it doesnt work, remove it.

~Don
 

J.T.

ಠ_ಠ
I honestly think the point system could work if a few dedicated people are willing to work on it. Those who want direct prizes may be able to get them by (like my previous suggestion) separate prizes awarded by beating all the Gym Leaders, beating the E4, and beating/becoming the Champion.

I heard a suggestion for badges as well; I see no reason why we couldn't incorporate a badge system in addition to points and prizes. I'm half decent at spriting, so I might be able to make a set of badges; however, there are probably tons of people who are better than me at that sort of thing, so.
 

goldfan

playing an ish game
I honestly think the point system could work if a few dedicated people are willing to work on it. Those who want direct prizes may be able to get them by (like my previous suggestion) separate prizes awarded by beating all the Gym Leaders, beating the E4, and beating/becoming the Champion.

I heard a suggestion for badges as well; I see no reason why we couldn't incorporate a badge system in addition to points and prizes. I'm half decent at spriting, so I might be able to make a set of badges; however, there are probably tons of people who are better than me at that sort of thing, so.

You could give the spriting a go, I'd be interested to see what sort of thing we could come up with. Something small enough for challengers to have in their sigs would be awesome ;)
 

phop

(D)
I see where you are coming from, and i agree to some extent. While it seems like a massive amount of work, it really isnt. The basis is this. A victory in the league earns you points. In the beginning, it would only be limited. The only way to earn points is by defeating a leader, e4 member or the Champion. the set amount will be decided. What makes it so simple is that when a leader, e4 member or the Champion looses. they PM the Committee member who would be running the Corner. The Committee members would then update the post to include the points. Also, this Committee member would be the one conducting the trades for the prizes. That makes it simple to deduct points. Its rather simple if you think about it.

I'm playing devil's advocate right now, so don't take this the wrong way. Some people (like me) enjoy running things like this. If a dedicated person is running it, it wont fail. I think it is a good idea because like i said before. I will give people something to show for their battles. The items will always be a reminder of their feats. Also, it could help them improve their battling skills. Also, the badges. I know that they are special, but i think it would be better to say to people, "Hey look I got this Ultra rare Legendary for beating Serebii's league." This might not mean anything to us oldies, but to a newer battler, it means more than a link to a badge. A badge is proud to display, but to use a pokemon that you trained hard for is even better in my opinion. Its like i always say. My favorite pokemon in the games is my Latios. I trained him all the way to 100 by battling. Proudest moment in my life! I wouldnt feel great if i did all that work and all i got to show for it was a badge!

Like i'm saying now. Give it a try. If it doesnt work, remove it.

~Don

It's just not the amount of work it involves, it has other flaws. Like you get points for achieving wins in the league, but to complete the league their are only 12 battle wins at most. So the system would see minimal use. Also if we want the league to be taken seriously, we're best sticking to badges. This doesn't rule out Gym leaders prizes, if they choose to have them that is.
 

ellie

Δ
Staff member
Admin
Well you guys have done a good job answering my questions so far (and I didn't even think about inactivity, which someone else mentioned and is probably a big issue too that I forgot about). Uh yeah... not much else to add but there are some good ideas and stuff.
 

J.T.

ಠ_ಠ
I'd really like to know how having a point system would keep us from being taken seriously.

Not getting many points and having it used very little isn't that big a deal; it makes it a lot easier to keep track of, honestly, and we could also have an "ultimate" prize which requires the maximum amount of points to get.
 
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