Caluminousdugtrio
class on my back
Ohhh haha i forgot we discussed this already. My bad 
But I really dont see Palkias anymore
But I really dont see Palkias anymore
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Ubers Thread
- Thread starter Caluminousdugtrio
- Start date
- Status
UbersSuck20
#FreeGenesect
Palkia is still very common in Uberz because of its ability to check Kyogre. Ummm... maybe because Ferrothorn gives it competition at this role? Except Palkia is an all-out offensive monster and Ferrothorn is a defensive support Pokemon, so their jobs are totally differrent.
Ultimate Champion
The Great Pokémon Master
What is your favorite moveset for the Incarnate Forme of Thundurus? Mine is:
Indignation (Thundurus) (M) @ Focus Sash
Trait: Prankster
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Taunt
- Thunder Wave
- Thunderbolt
I used this Thundurus as an anti-lead in the early versions of Flames of the Heavenly Light, as you can see under the "Team building process" section of that thread. With its Prankster-enhanced Taunt, it served the purpose of preventing the opponent's lead from setting up entry hazards and preventing lead Darkrai from using Dark Void while paralyzing it with its Prankster-enhanced Thunder Wave, which was also very helpful against numerous fast Pokémon including Latias, Latios, Mewtwo, Darkrai, Shaymin-S and Choice Scarf Pokémon whenever Thundurus survived long enough in the match to get to face them, which was rather common as it often found itself forced out by the Dragon Tails of lead Dialga and Groudon. And with its Same Type Attack Bonus Thunderbolt, as well as Hidden Power [Ice] for coverage, most notably against Groudon, Thundurus also packed decent offensive power. Of course, it worked much more effectively in DW Ubers due to the lack of Team Preview combined with people's tendency to lead with their entry hazard setters, whereas in Wifi Ubers, people may not lead with such upon seeing a Thundurus in the Team Preview.
Indignation (Thundurus) (M) @ Focus Sash
Trait: Prankster
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Taunt
- Thunder Wave
- Thunderbolt
I used this Thundurus as an anti-lead in the early versions of Flames of the Heavenly Light, as you can see under the "Team building process" section of that thread. With its Prankster-enhanced Taunt, it served the purpose of preventing the opponent's lead from setting up entry hazards and preventing lead Darkrai from using Dark Void while paralyzing it with its Prankster-enhanced Thunder Wave, which was also very helpful against numerous fast Pokémon including Latias, Latios, Mewtwo, Darkrai, Shaymin-S and Choice Scarf Pokémon whenever Thundurus survived long enough in the match to get to face them, which was rather common as it often found itself forced out by the Dragon Tails of lead Dialga and Groudon. And with its Same Type Attack Bonus Thunderbolt, as well as Hidden Power [Ice] for coverage, most notably against Groudon, Thundurus also packed decent offensive power. Of course, it worked much more effectively in DW Ubers due to the lack of Team Preview combined with people's tendency to lead with their entry hazard setters, whereas in Wifi Ubers, people may not lead with such upon seeing a Thundurus in the Team Preview.
UbersSuck20
#FreeGenesect
My favourite set is the same as yours, but with Thunder over Thunderbolt because I don't really use Thundurus on sun teams.
Caluminousdugtrio
class on my back
Genesect@Choice Band
EVS: 252 Atk; 252 Spd; 4 SpA
Trait: Download
Nature: Hasty
- Extremespeed
- Blaze Kick
- U-Turn
- Iron Head/Ice Beam
CB Genesect. I've never actually used it but it seems quite effective. Blaze Kick kills Ferrothorn, and deals tons of damage even in Rain. Extremespeed is a neat priority and is one of the many reasons to use CB over CS. U-Turn is to gain momentum, and the choice of the last move is up to you. Iron Head can be used if you hate Terrakion and the Kyurem formes.
Ultimate Champion
The Great Pokémon Master
My favorite moveset for the final Über in the Generation V Übers metagame to be discussed in this thread (at least until Smogon bans yet another Pokémon from OU in Generation V), which also happens to be the final Pokémon in the National PokéDex as of Generation V:
Jesus (Genesect) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Download
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
Naive Nature
- Explosion
- Flamethrower
- Ice Beam
- U-turn
I personally favor the physically-offensive set for Genesect over the specially-offensive one, as this set maximizes the power of Choice Scarf Genesect's most commonly-used move, U-turn, allowing it to manage incredible feats such as ripping out more than half the health of an offensive Kyogre after a Download boost, and also maximizing the power of its Explosion. Ice Beam is a great coverage move mainly for eliminating Groudon and revenge-killing Rayquaza, and Flamethrower is for incinerating Steel-type Pokémon, and in the Sun, it is just a really powerful attack especially with a Download boost.
Jesus (Genesect) @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Download
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
Naive Nature
- Explosion
- Flamethrower
- Ice Beam
- U-turn
I personally favor the physically-offensive set for Genesect over the specially-offensive one, as this set maximizes the power of Choice Scarf Genesect's most commonly-used move, U-turn, allowing it to manage incredible feats such as ripping out more than half the health of an offensive Kyogre after a Download boost, and also maximizing the power of its Explosion. Ice Beam is a great coverage move mainly for eliminating Groudon and revenge-killing Rayquaza, and Flamethrower is for incinerating Steel-type Pokémon, and in the Sun, it is just a really powerful attack especially with a Download boost.
UbersSuck20
#FreeGenesect
My favourite Genesect set is the Choice Band set with ExtremeSpeed and Flamethrower. ExtremeSpeed trolls Ho-Oh, OHKOing it after Stealth Rock damage without having to sacrifice Genesect, and Flamethrower hits Ferrothorn and its pals hard, getting a boost in the sun.
Touché Amoré
WAKABA-KU
Genesect @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Download
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Hasty Nature
- Thunder
- Flamethrower
- Ice Beam
- U-turn
Genesect is another one of those Pokemon that I do not see much use for outside of a Scarf User since other wise they are outpaced by many faster Pokemon and Scarfers who can easily do great harm to it
Genesect @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Download
EVs: 252 Atk / 32 SpA / 224 Spe
Naive Nature
- U-turn
- Explosion
- Iron Head
- Ice Beam
I like this variant sometimes to. I also used the RP variant a few times to very limited due to issues I mentioned earlier...that and the fact that more often then not Genesect is not going to be forcing out to many Pokemon or at least is not going to be KOing to many of them right off the bat (And then dying usually) but ah nimporte quoi
Caluminousdugtrio
class on my back
I think we should start discussing some strategies now. Lets start with the most popular battling format ATM: Rain Offense.
Personally, I think Rain Offense is a very simple and effective strategy, especially for new Uber players. A nice core of Kyogre, Ferrothorn, and Kabutops give quite good results and compliment each other. The sheer power from rain as well makes it a very appealing weather for offensive teams, such as Choice Scarf/Choice Specs Kyogre (the latter 2HKOing even Blissey), Kabutops, coupled with the extra speed from Swift Swim makes it a deadly cleaner and revenge-killer. Many other good Pokemon for rain offense include but are not limited to: Lati@s twins, Rayquaza, Omastar (yes Omastar), Palkia, Dialga and Genesect.
Personally, I think Rain Offense is a very simple and effective strategy, especially for new Uber players. A nice core of Kyogre, Ferrothorn, and Kabutops give quite good results and compliment each other. The sheer power from rain as well makes it a very appealing weather for offensive teams, such as Choice Scarf/Choice Specs Kyogre (the latter 2HKOing even Blissey), Kabutops, coupled with the extra speed from Swift Swim makes it a deadly cleaner and revenge-killer. Many other good Pokemon for rain offense include but are not limited to: Lati@s twins, Rayquaza, Omastar (yes Omastar), Palkia, Dialga and Genesect.
OceanicLanturn
Non non non!
Wow, rain huh? I tried this guy in my rain team and he shot up to my favorite rain 'sweeper'.
Ludicolo @ Choice Specs / Life Orb
Trait: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Modest Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Grass Knot
- Focus Blast
- Ice Beam / Surf
Ludicolo @ Choice Specs / Life Orb
Trait: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Modest Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Grass Knot
- Focus Blast
- Ice Beam / Surf
jireh the provider
Video Game Designer
Wow, rain huh? I tried this guy in my rain team and he shot up to my favorite rain 'sweeper'.
Ludicolo @ Choice Specs / Life Orb
Trait: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Modest Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Grass Knot
- Focus Blast
- Ice Beam / Surf
from my obervations, I guess this Villa`Mexicano pokemon can take at least 4 to 5 water spouts from Kyogre on full health I guess? or just 2? But still, this guy could beat Groudon too. But difficult to pull off I bet since sun comes in.
Still, this guys has an interesting niche in Ubers so far
Ultimate Champion
The Great Pokémon Master
Although I have reached #4 on the Pokémon Online server's DW Ubers ladder as well as #2 on Pokémon Showdown!'s Smogon University server's ubers ladder with rain offense, I do not really like this playstyle that much due to its tendency to be walled by/struggle against many incredibly common Pokémon such as Dialga, Giratina-A, Latias, and by far most importantly, Ferrothorn, and I also do not like how incredibly steep of an uphill battle rain offense has to fight against rain stall, which I believe to be one of the strongest team archetypes in Übers.
That said, by far my favorite method of offensively abusing rain in Übers is by making a team completely packed with Pokémon with high Special Attack that use the move Thunder, as I find that the opponent is typically put under enormous pressure when this move is spammed in excess (provided most or all of the users of this move have a way to easily threaten Pokémon that are resistant or immune to Electric, of course, hence why in my most successful rain offense team, four of the team's five Thunder users are special attacking Dragon-type Pokémon), due to its high paralysis chance which often gives it an edge against offensive teams, while also being incredibly disruptive against defensive teams, as the chance of the opponent's defensive Pokémon being fully paralyzed can often make them miss out on crucial turns on which they desperately need to use a healing move. Additionally, Thunder's ability to hit the great wall Lugia super effectively, while greatly threatening to paralyze it (and therefore preventing it from being able to go first and use Roost while possibly also activating Multiscale, in order to lessen the damage it takes from Thunder) is incredibly awesome too. Unfortunately, Ferrothorn still remains as the biggest issue though, being able to serve as a huge nuisance by using Leech Seed, Thunder Wave, or setting up entry hazards, and I found this the case for my own rain offense team despite the fact that three of its members knew Fighting-type moves.
That said, by far my favorite method of offensively abusing rain in Übers is by making a team completely packed with Pokémon with high Special Attack that use the move Thunder, as I find that the opponent is typically put under enormous pressure when this move is spammed in excess (provided most or all of the users of this move have a way to easily threaten Pokémon that are resistant or immune to Electric, of course, hence why in my most successful rain offense team, four of the team's five Thunder users are special attacking Dragon-type Pokémon), due to its high paralysis chance which often gives it an edge against offensive teams, while also being incredibly disruptive against defensive teams, as the chance of the opponent's defensive Pokémon being fully paralyzed can often make them miss out on crucial turns on which they desperately need to use a healing move. Additionally, Thunder's ability to hit the great wall Lugia super effectively, while greatly threatening to paralyze it (and therefore preventing it from being able to go first and use Roost while possibly also activating Multiscale, in order to lessen the damage it takes from Thunder) is incredibly awesome too. Unfortunately, Ferrothorn still remains as the biggest issue though, being able to serve as a huge nuisance by using Leech Seed, Thunder Wave, or setting up entry hazards, and I found this the case for my own rain offense team despite the fact that three of its members knew Fighting-type moves.
UbersSuck20
#FreeGenesect
What's your favourite Ferrothorn set?
Mine is this one:
Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Trait: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 48 Atk / 208 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Spikes
- Power Whip
- Leech Seed
- Protect
Basically the same set as in OU, but with 48 Atk EVs to break Arceus-Dark's Substitutes with Power Whip.
Mine is this one:
Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Trait: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 48 Atk / 208 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Spikes
- Power Whip
- Leech Seed
- Protect
Basically the same set as in OU, but with 48 Atk EVs to break Arceus-Dark's Substitutes with Power Whip.
Caluminousdugtrio
class on my back
Exact same moveset with just a tweak to the EVS: 252 HP/36 Def/220 SpD
Is it just me or is the fact that most Legendaries are considered Ubers just sad?
Personally I feel it only applies if somebody EV Trains a specific Legendary to be unbeatable.
Most of the only good Pokemon I have are Legendaries and no matter what I always lose with or without them.
I don't see it as fair or fun anymore just battling random people.
I don't even have friends to battle anymore either.
Personally I feel it only applies if somebody EV Trains a specific Legendary to be unbeatable.
Most of the only good Pokemon I have are Legendaries and no matter what I always lose with or without them.
I don't see it as fair or fun anymore just battling random people.
I don't even have friends to battle anymore either.
Touché Amoré
WAKABA-KU
Well , it isnt like them being considered Uber is not called for. It isnt sad. It just so happens that all Cover Legendarys have rediculous stats that would be overpowering or at least very over centralizing in OU metagame or any metagame below that. Its like you are implying you think Pokemon like Ho-Oh or Kyogre should be allowed in same metagame as Pokemon like Gliscor and Venusaur. That would just terribly throw the metagame out of balance. Also it does not only apply if you EV train. They are already very powerful as it is. Also in competitive all Pokemon no matter what tier are EV trained as well so why have you even brought that up at all? "Most of the only good Pokemon I have are Legendaries and no matter what I always lose with or without them." Do you ... not have a working knowledge of tiers? It seems like this is you and your friends who do not have much knowledge of competitive playing against each other with your ingame teams...and all this means is that they are to powerful for any lower tier and that you must not be a experienced player if you can not win without them. Anyway , I have a hard time understanding completely what you are trying to say but it seems you dont even know what you are talking about. Well nimporte quoi the Legendarys that are in Ubers are in there for good reason. Also
To be fair, most legendaries are NOT Ubers. Its just most the really overpowered, 680+ BST ones, that are Ubers. Some are horrible in the competitive metagame. Take a look at Articuno and Regigigas - They are both NU because they have major flaws that makes them almost unusable anywhere else. Regigigas should be obvious - Slow Start halves its Attack and Speed for the first five turns, effectively making it almost unusable. Articuno has decent defensive-oriented stats and movepool but it has an awful defensive typing which makes Stealth Rock take 50% on entry (tbh If the OHKO clause was lifted, Articuno would leave NU because it can use its deadly Mind Reader + Sheer Cold combo).
Out of the legendaries that are Uber, several of them were allowed in OU for a period of time and eventually got banned because they proved to be broken or too overcentralizing to be in OU. Off the top of my head I can remember that Thundurus-I, Tornadus-T, Genesect and Landorus-I got banned in this way.
The majority of legendaries, particularly the weaker ones, are in OU or lower tiers. Jirachi, despite its annoying Paraflinch hax, has just enough checks and counters to remain in OU. Heatran has a horrible 4x weakness to Ground (which not everyone covers with Air Ballon) and takes 2x damage from Water and Fighting, which are all common attacking types, and is slow by OU standards. Mew, while having the widest movepool in the game bar Smeargle, has a sub-par defensive type and insufficient stats to abuse its movepool enough to get it banned. Moltres is outclassed by Oh-Ho, etc...
The only way legendaries can get banned to Ubers is if they are proven to be too powerful for OU, just like everything else including Blaziken and Excadrill.
Caluminousdugtrio
class on my back
Theres a little called tiers where Pokemon are divided so they can compete against other pokes that have the same degree of power. And look, it doesnt matter whether or not most Legendaries are in Ubers or not; they're just divided into different tiers so a Palkia isnt going to face off against a Magikarp.
UbersSuck20
#FreeGenesect
No. Many legendaries aren't even uberz, only those with 680+ BST not named Kyurem-B. And non-uber legends just aren't overpowered, like Articuno (who's quad-weak to Stealth Rock and doesn't hit very hard), Regirock (who's just too slow, has loads of weaknesses and doesn't hit much harder than Articuno) and even Kyurem-B (who has an awful movepool and a secondary Ice-typing which broughts him weaknesses to stealth rock, Mach Punch and Bullet Punch).
Caluminousdugtrio
class on my back
6th Gen is coming ever closer.
Well, theres not much to discuss. how about sand? Its quite a stally weather in Ubers as not many pokemon function as powerful sweepers in that weather bar Excadrill. What do you guys think?
Well, theres not much to discuss. how about sand? Its quite a stally weather in Ubers as not many pokemon function as powerful sweepers in that weather bar Excadrill. What do you guys think?
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