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Ultra Class! VS Elite Four Drasna! (1193)

Blood Red

【推しの子】
This. Unonoragon took an interest in Onion duck like the summaries said and this was the start of their friendship. They didn’t force some friendship that didn’t exist out of the blue. Even if they did nothing hinges on that, not like one will Mega Evolve or do Helping Hand thus they need a friendship. Just the episode and writers doing something good.

Mid battle but I won’t take Onion duck x Abomination slander as this was the highlight of the episode and the narrative doesn’t force them as retroactive besties or anything like that from what I could tell.
I think people would've preferred a bit more than a single episode for them to basically turn into what seems like the best of friends, especially since they've been on the same team for more than 50 episodes.
 

Blue Saturday

Unfurl your Blessed Wings!
I think people would've preferred a bit more than a single episode for them to basically turn into what seems like the best of friends, especially since they've been on the same team for more than 50 episodes.
This was perfectly fine and setup their friendship fine, no one said they were besties just that they cared for one another. It also gave Ganpi the chance to see how the duck got its lesson in chivalry and caring for its comrades. We don’t need multiple episodes of setup for this kind of thing, it was organic and completely unnecessary and didn’t impact the narrative or battle in anyway (new transformation, double battle tactics)


 

Blood Red

【推しの子】
This was perfectly fine and setup their friendship fine, no one said they were besties just that they cared for one another. It also gave Ganpi the chance to see how the duck got its lesson in chivalry and caring for its comrades. We don’t need multiple episodes of setup for this kind of thing, it was organic and completely unnecessary and didn’t impact the narrative or battle in anyway (new transformation, double battle tactics)
Eh, the whole 'literally popping out of their balls to cheer each other on' thing still felt incredibly forced to me, especially when they haven't interacted much before this despite being in the same team for fifty episodes. Good for you if you like it, won't change the fact that I, and a ton of others, thought it felt rather out-of-place.
Why? This is not the climax to a long running friendship, it's a newly formed one. You're just asking for a different kind of story.
Because it came more than 50 episodes after Dracovish joined Ash, and felt rather out-of-place with how it developed in the middle of a match against an Elite Four member; one that wasn't even a double battle.
 

Nikinini

Well-Known Member
Eh, the whole 'literally popping out of their balls to cheer each other on' thing still felt incredibly forced to me, especially when they haven't interacted much before this despite being in the same team for fifty episodes. Good for you if you like it, won't change the fact that I, and a ton of others, thought it felt rather out-of-place.

Because it came more than 50 episodes after Dracovish joined Ash, and felt rather out-of-place with how it developed in the middle of a match against an Elite Four member; one that wasn't even a double battle.
Middle of a match? Did you watch the previous episode?
 

Blue Saturday

Unfurl your Blessed Wings!
Eh, the whole 'literally popping out of their balls to cheer each other on' thing still felt incredibly forced to me, especially when they haven't interacted much before this despite being in the same team for fifty episodes. Good for you if you like it, won't change the fact that I, and a ton of others, thought it felt rather out-of-place.
I mean, you’re free to feel how you want to feel I’m just not seeing what the need is for “presetup” for a friendship they just established here. Their lack of it before doesn’t mean they shouldn’t now especially when it harmed nothing and improved on an aspect PM2019 gets maligned for in not having more Pokémon dynamic, personalities and interactions. They’ve set up friendship before latter in sagas. This just feels a tad nitpicky.


The freak fossil took an interest in the duck and they became simple homies, it doesn’t need to be deeper than that. Just a cool guy and his eccentric bud.
 

Blood Red

【推しの子】
I mean, you’re free to feel how you want to feel I’m just not seeing what the need is for “presetup” for a friendship they just established here. Their lack of it before doesn’t mean they shouldn’t now especially when it harmed nothing and improved on an aspect PM2019 gets maligned for in not having more Pokémon dynamic, personalities and interactions. They’ve set up friendship before latter in sagas. This just feels a tad nitpicky.


The freak fossil took an interest in the duck and they became simple homies, it doesn’t need to be deeper than that. Just a cool guy and his eccentric bud.
idk dude, you do you but I can't get over how incredibly rushed this whole thing felt. I'd be all for this friendship if we got even a hint of it in the 50 episodes they've been on the same team together. Plus, people are allowed to complain about things that felt poorly handled.

In the end, it's not as big of a deal as the millions of other problems this episode had, but I still hesitate to call this a convincing friendship when it felt like it popped up out of nowhere.
 

TheLink

Eunie is as Eunie does.
Boy does this feel good. Weird how people immediately caught that THIS battle was weird and not questioning if Darsna (a character we’ve never seen) is Elite Four tier or wondering how she lost despite her strength never being established. Justice for Darsna because Sirfetch was able to tank a bunch of moves and the battle being in her court most of the battle until Ash randomly turned it around. Seems familiar?

Anyways subliminal messages aside, this has got to be the most boring battle yet, dare I say that BW had better battles than this. Altaria literally mega evolved just to show that Ash was stupid about type immunity
In regards to your first point, I’d say it’s specifically because Iris suddenly being Champion, which is a hell of a jump considering she’s an established character we know in-universe that had no prior interest in the title (or even being a Gym Leader for that matter), which is a much different situation compared to a member of an Elite Four appearing for the first time. I’m the latter scenario we don’t have a prior appearance to compare with so of course people are taking her being Elite Four to be a tough opponent. We haven’t seen anything from Drasna before now to indicate anything else, so her going out so suddenly challenges that impression in a jarring way.

We get it, you like Iris, but people are allowed to have issues with her sudden Champion status and how it was presented batts-wise.


On the note of the episode itself, it was disappointing. First official fight against an a Elite Four member that ends up with boring animation and flow that’s all over the place.
 
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Garbodor.

Well-Known Member
I waited years to see him defeat a trainer at this level but honestly the way they went around this battle was quite bad. Either he is at the level to defeat champions/elite 4s or he is not. If he is, then they should not be making him get battered all over the place and win by some very hard to believe OHKO etc. I am really hoping they handle the upcoming masters 8 episodes much better. Overall I am happy to see him defeat an elite 4, but comeone writers, you can do a better job!
 

GGuitarGuy95

Well-Known Member
Ash finally beats a Champion and E4 and it’s one of the most anti-climatic victories yet. Do we really need comedy in battles this far? It was acceptable vs Kukkui due to the tone of the series and it was largely a match that didn’t had much stakes at all.
 

SerGoldenhandtheJust

Deluded Dreamer
Probably my fault for trusting mistranslations of the Chinese leaks but gods am I so disappointed this wasnt a double battle. 2v2 feels pointless and resulted in more padding of time leading to a rushed outcome compared to say just having a double battle from the start so we need less time leading to a more organic ending, no OHKOs, a better display of the galar mons bond which admittedly was done great, and something new and fresh for the PWC. I really think a double battle would have given more of an 'epic' feeling of Ash finally defeating an E4 member compared to a simple 2v2 filled with OHKOs and rushed
Boy does this feel good. Weird how people immediately caught that THIS battle was weird and not questioning if Darsna (a character we’ve never seen) is Elite Four tier or wondering how she lost despite her strength never being established. Justice for Darsna because Sirfetch was able to tank a bunch of moves and the battle being in her court most of the battle until Ash randomly turned it around. Seems familiar?

Anyways subliminal messages aside, this has got to be the most boring battle yet, dare I say that BW had better battles than this. Altaria literally mega evolved just to show that Ash was stupid about type immunity
I mean, those are completely different situations. People arent mad Drasna lost because of the position she has, its coz the battle was written weirdly with her having the upper hand only to lose in a contrived OHKO manner. The Iris battle was much better written compared to this, sure it had its weird powerscaling but the overall choreography was done better
Ash finally beats a Champion and E4 and it’s one of the most anti-climatic victories yet. Do we really need comedy in battles this far? It was acceptable vs Kukkui due to the tone of the series and it was largely a match that didn’t had much stakes at all.
Ash vs Kukui didnt even have comedy that took away from the battle, just organic comedy being borne from interactions and the aftermath of cool moments
Why is everyone getting mad about a funny battle? It's April Fish day, which means April Mr. Fish day
The fun bits arent a problem, I liked the comedy, its just how the overall battle was written
Narrative wise, character interaction and personality wise and comedy wise these episodes were perfect 10/10s
But the poor battle choreography really pulls it down, esp when its such a pivotal moment for Ash
 

Bobbay

Member
I literally made an account to say that this is possibly the worst "big" battle we've had since the Best Wishes league, and it's an elite four member! They're slowly getting worse and even the animation is wonkier. I hope the budget goes up for the champion battles, please anime gods. Only thing that makes this ok is that it's April Fools Day.
 

TheNewGuy

Well-Known Member
Lmfao did you watch this episode?? Ash literally got his ass beat and somehow pulled a win out of his entire ass. He did not win this episode in anyway shape of form and looked like a complete clown in the process.

Yeah, except for the part where he won. It doesn't matter if the circumstances weren't to your taste, the idea that him winning against an E4 member for the first time in 20+ years makes him look "weak" is nonsense. I understand frustrations with the way the battle was executed, and if that was all you were complaining about I'd say nothing. But these are totally separate criticisms. This is the strongest Ash we've ever had, and today was further evidence of that.
 

Almighty Zard

He has returned.
i mean for anyone who's been around since AG, the way the battle was handled shouldn't be a new concept.

cause the majority of his hoenn and battle frontier matches were like that.

I mean @Dephender brought up the battle arena and Snorlax, what about the battle dome and his match with tucker?

Corphish and Swellow got hit by numerous attacks and extremely well calculated combinations and still came out the winner with effectively 1 hit each, if you watched that and didn't complain you can't complain about this fight.
 
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TheNewGuy

Well-Known Member
Oh you can complain about this fight for a dozen reasons beyond "Ash took too much punishment". It seemed slow, lethargic almost...there was nothing special in the animation, and it lacked clever strategy.

It had problems way beyond offensive imbalance. Though I agree, I don't think that's much of a criticism.
 

Almighty Zard

He has returned.
Oh you can complain about this fight for a dozen reasons beyond "Ash took too much punishment". It seemed slow, lethargic almost...there was nothing special in the animation, and it lacked clever strategy.

It had problems way beyond offensive imbalance. Though I agree, I don't think that's much of a criticism.

ain't as bad as Pikachu vs Seperior either, because Ash at least trained before this match.
 
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