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Underrated threats

Pokemom

TCG Gym Leader, Ret.
Scarf Haxorus. Not many People use it, but it acts as a great revenge killer to multiple things, the honorable mention being a DDNite at Full Health (Mold Breaker).

I don't know if anyone uses it, but Choice Band Virizion is very great anti-lead in a post-Deoxys metagame.

Virizion@Choice Band
(+Spe, -Def)/Justified
252 Att/4 SpAtt/252 Spe
-Close Combat
-Leaf Blade
-Hidden Power (Ice)
-X-Scissor

the Leads

6) Dnite- Hidden Power Ice 2HKOs

if you get 2 hits off then great:

Dragonite (Mild or Hasty) @ Expert Belt
Ability: Marvel Scale
EVs: 252SA/___/____ (64 HP / 192 Spd / 252 SAtk or 4 HP/ 252 Spd / 252 SAtk (mild), 56 HP/ 200 Spd / 252 SAtk (hasty))

- Hurricane
- Ice Beam
- Flamethrower
- Focus Blast

Surprise Special Specialist I'm building for VGC...I can see STAB Hurricane + Belt OHKOing Verizion (who has double weakness if I'm not mistaken).
 

garchompmaster29

Xatu>Espeon
Timid nature max speed and s.atk scarfmence with draco meteor, hydro pump and fire blast(soon to be replaced with flamethrower.) I used it to take out a latios and a Haxorus with 2 consecutive draco meteors. Hydro pump decimates Heatran and flame thrower decimates everything the first two don't kill in one hit(excluding eviolite holders and blissy/chancy.)


You mean Naive nature mence? Because if you were running a mixed scarfer, than you would be running Naive.
 

redcharzard

Semi-competitive
You mean Naive nature mence? Because if you were running a mixed scarfer, than you would be running Naive.

Special Salamence with timid nature no physical attacks(yet for some reason it has dragon dance??? I just left it on there) I wanted the extra speed to outrun all pokemon with 99 or lower speed that have choice scarf. This really surprised my freind(not nearly as much as KOing 2 dragons in a row with 2 consecutive draco meteors.)
 

kaiser soze

Reading ADWD
Special Salamence with timid nature no physical attacks(yet for some reason it has dragon dance??? I just left it on there) I wanted the extra speed to outrun all pokemon with 99 or lower speed that have choice scarf. This really surprised my freind(not nearly as much as KOing 2 dragons in a row with 2 consecutive draco meteors.)
Playing devil's advocate: what makes special Salamence better than Hydreigon? Also, you can argue that Salamence is better off physically sweeping thanks to Moxie.
 
I think Acrobatics Tornadus is an underrated threat, with Acrobatics/Brick Break/U-turn/filler it can do a nice sweep, when someone is expecting Hurricane Tornadus.
 

redcharzard

Semi-competitive
Playing devil's advocate: what makes special Salamence better than Hydreigon? Also, you can argue that Salamence is better off physically sweeping thanks to Moxie.

Intimidate Increase Salamence survivability so Its a mixed trade off. As for what makes it better only the 100 base speed(max with timid is 328) and it really surprises the oppenent

I think Acrobatics Tornadus is an underrated threat, with Acrobatics/Brick Break/U-turn/filler it can do a nice sweep, when someone is expecting Hurricane Tornadus.

Taunt/other non damaging move as filler and Accrobatics with a flying gem on a flying pokemon has a total power(accounting for base power, move effect, flying gem, and stab) 247.5 power(2.5 points weaker then non-stabed explosion) I use it on sand veil Gliscor and it took out over 50% of my freind eviolite dusclops's hp.
 

Kalslaffin

Herping the Durp
I dont know if anyone really wants to hear about NU pokes, but Cacturne in my opinion is underrated. Ive used him in my UU sand team before and ive actually swept with the swords dance, sucker punch, seed bomb, and substitute set. with sand veil and lefties recovery, he`s actually very effective. After a swords dance with 252 attack EVs and an Adamant nature he hits 722 attack. And if they miss because of Cacturne being in sand (which my arguement is he`s underrated in sand), then Cacturne gets a free 120 power after stab sucker punch off, which when non resisted and coming from 722 attack wont feel too good.
 

garchompmaster29

Xatu>Espeon
@redcharizard:

Yes, Salamence has intimidate, but hydreigon has 92/90/90 defenses, is not weak to rock, is not 4X weak to ice, and has u-turn, all of which make it a strong scarfer.

Also, latios comes to mind. It far out powers and outspeeds scarf mence, and has STAB psyshock and trick. All of these things make it superior to fully special mence. I just don't see why you would run it over hydreigon or latios.
 

redcharzard

Semi-competitive
@redcharizard:

Yes, Salamence has intimidate, but hydreigon has 92/90/90 defenses, is not weak to rock, is not 4X weak to ice, and has u-turn, all of which make it a strong scarfer.

Also, latios comes to mind. It far out powers and outspeeds scarf mence, and has STAB psyshock and trick. All of these things make it superior to fully special mence. I just don't see why you would run it over hydreigon or latios.

One other thing Salamence has surprise factor(you can go battle a random salamence and ther is no telling me that you can be 100% sure of what it is running.) The Scarf special set is meant to confuse your oppenent and make him/her make a mistake. Also Hydreigon has a 2x weakness to flying and unlike Salamence is hit by mold breaker earthquake.

On another topic While not a pokemon Gravity is a under rated attack that can force flying types to the gound(all those fire/rock/steel/electric flying types and those with levitate don't like that) and decrease evansion by 2 stages so any pokemon with gravity can cause a lot of trouble for teams that need those types/ability
 
One other thing Salamence has surprise factor(you can go battle a random salamence and ther is no telling me that you can be 100% sure of what it is running.) The Scarf special set is meant to confuse your oppenent and make him/her make a mistake. Also Hydreigon has a 2x weakness to flying and unlike Salamence is hit by mold breaker earthquake.

On another topic While not a pokemon Gravity is a under rated attack that can force flying types to the gound(all those fire/rock/steel/electric flying types and those with levitate don't like that) and decrease evansion by 2 stages so any pokemon with gravity can cause a lot of trouble for teams that need those types/ability

Neither of Dark or Dragon are hit super effectively by the absurdly rare Flying type. Hydreigon also has the movepool advantage, with things like Dark Pulse and Earth Power for offense, while having U-turn for scouting. Salamence has none of those three attacks, 15 less Special Attack, and a weakness to Stealth Rock.
 

redcharzard

Semi-competitive
Neither of Dark or Dragon are hit super effectively by the absurdly rare Flying type. Hydreigon also has the movepool advantage, with things like Dark Pulse and Earth Power for offense, while having U-turn for scouting. Salamence has none of those three attacks, 15 less Special Attack, and a weakness to Stealth Rock.

1st My bad I meant fighting which is pretty common.
2nd Special sweeping Hydreigon is not under rated its over rated.
3rd.Hydreigon is predictable if you compare it to Salamence(I don't mean it isn't strong or difficult to counter(I use it a lot and it wreaks havoc) what I mean is that Hydreigon almost always runs special sets and as it's physical sets are less impressive while Salamence can not only run a fully operating special set with perfect coverage(Hydro pump is Salamence counter for Heatran which is the only thing that block fire and dragon) but can also run half a dozen other sets so you can never trully predict it.)
 

Zachmac

Well-Known Member
I dont know if anyone really wants to hear about NU pokes, but Cacturne in my opinion is underrated. Ive used him in my UU sand team before and ive actually swept with the swords dance, sucker punch, seed bomb, and substitute set. with sand veil and lefties recovery, he`s actually very effective. After a swords dance with 252 attack EVs and an Adamant nature he hits 722 attack. And if they miss because of Cacturne being in sand (which my arguement is he`s underrated in sand), then Cacturne gets a free 120 power after stab sucker punch off, which when non resisted and coming from 722 attack wont feel too good.
Not really. Low speed and defenses are a terrible combination. 70/60/60 defenses are terrible, and it is very slow to make that worse.

I think it's outclassed by Bisharp, at the very least.
2nd Special sweeping Hydreigon is not under rated its over rated.
There are a lot of people that'll try and convince you Latios is better in every way.
1st My bad I meant fighting which is pretty common.
So? Ferrothorn is also x2 weak to fighting. That thing still makes an amazing physical wall.
 

TrollFreak

Pit is Awesome :P
Bisharp is UU, Cacturne is NU like he said

EDIT- The whole point is to abuse Sucker Punch, which ignores speed anyways
 

Zachmac

Well-Known Member
^But he was talking about UU battles. Reread the post.

Yeah, it ignores speed, but you're going to rely on that alone? Sucker Punch does help to make up for that problem a bit, but it's not enough to make a pokemon good.
 

TrollFreak

Pit is Awesome :P
There are a lot of people that'll try and convince you Latios is better in every way.

Fire Blast
No Pursuit Weakness(A resist actually)
Latios- 80/80/110 to Hydra's 92/90/90
U-Turn to avoid Counters
Focus Blast to beat T-Tar and Sp.Def Tran w/ Specs

No, it itsn't outclassed, both have niches over the other

EDIT- Yea, re read the post, srry bout that

and if you oppo is scared of a +2 Sucker Punch, most run sub to set it up as oppo is pissing themselves over a Sucker Punch. Thats how you have to play w/ Sucker Punch mons, most run sub since it has such low PP, and as they attempt to stall, you set up a SD/Sub

in RU its can be decent, though it's scared of Honchkrow, but it can work

in UU, naw, Bisharp is better in everyway
 

Pichu47

Fear Me, If You Dare
^I said people will try to convince you that, not that I think so.

I use Hydreigon.

Yea, they both have their seperate niches. Hydreigon has better dual STAB's and pursuit resistance, but is kind of slow without scarf set. Latios is initially faster and has more power, but is weak to pursuit. They're different. Underrated poke=Rotom-C.
 

Kalslaffin

Herping the Durp
^But he was talking about UU battles. Reread the post.

Yeah, it ignores speed, but you're going to rely on that alone? Sucker Punch does help to make up for that problem a bit, but it's not enough to make a pokemon good.

I said I've used him on my UU sand team and actually swept with him. And yeah sucker punch isn't super reliable, but if the opponent wants to boost or switch, you have substitute and swords dance, so if it's predictable you can set up. Cacturne behind a sub with a swords dance under his belt is very hard to take down. Especially in NU. I know Cacturnes got crappy defense, but with a boost or two a 120 power priority move (after stab) is hard to stop.
 
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