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[UU Team]: The Madness of Grace

Discussion in 'Older Gen RMT' started by AdrianPKM, May 1, 2013.

  1. AdrianPKM

    AdrianPKM New Member

    EDITS AND CHANGES MADE IN RED!
    The Introduction:
    Hello Serebii forums! I've been a Pokemon player since Gen 1, when it was cool to play Pokemon Blue/Red during lunch!
    Lots of things have changed since then, all except my infatuation with Pokemon battles.

    The Play Style:
    I've never enjoyed sweep teams; not in gold and silver, not in ruby and saphire, not in diamond/pearl and certainly not in Black and White.

    I love long battles where patience is key and in the end it's the sum of all the choices made and all the predicted moves taken that matter. I play with tank and stall Pokemon, and while others may cringe at the thought of a 50-round battle, that's just the way I like it!

    Lets Get Intimate:
    [​IMG]
    Temperance (M) (Sableye) @ Lagging Tail
    Ability: Prankster
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpDef
    Nature: Bold (+Def, -Atk)
    Moveset:
    ~Trick
    ~Night Shade
    ~Will-o-Wisp
    ~Recover

    Moveset and Contribution: This spawn from the vowels of treasure filled caves from 3rd gen is usually my opener or my mid-game MVP. If from team preview I notice they have a poke that can set-up hazards, or prepare to baton pass,TAUNT ruins that possibility. It allows me to switch out to another poke and gives me two to three turns to K.O. said poke before it sets up. TRICK this is to completely cripple my opponents Cleric/Physical sweeper/ Eviolite Holder (I'm looking at you Gligar!). Will-o-Wisp Is to further cripple physical sweepers and walls. RECOVER lets me heal wall a physical sweeper or an opposing wall after the trick, while letting will-o-wisp eat away at their health. I use him to nullify Rapid-Spins and Fight-Type moves.

    Evs and Nature: Survivability is the key here. 304 HP Makes it so I'm not 3 H.K.O. by Night-Shade. Bold is needed to have 205 Def, combined with the 229 SDef, it allows me to take moderate hits from Sweepers.

    [​IMG]
    Humility (F) (Nidoqueen) @ LifeOrb
    Ability: Sheer Force
    EVs: 204 HP / 252 SpAtk / 52 Spe
    Nature: Modest (+SpAtk, - Atk)
    Moveset:
    ~Earth Power
    ~Ice Beam
    ~Focus Blast
    ~Stealth Rocks

    Moveset and Contribution: Nidoqueen is just wonderful, she is the embodiment of a tank Pokemon. With her solid SpAtk and broad move pool, High defensive stats and resistances, she is a force to be reckoned with! Depending on team preview I will either Lead with Sableye and taunt, then switch to Nidoqueen, or open up with Nidoqueen all-together.
    STAB Earth Power Generally 1 H.K.O. anything that it's super effective against, and 2 - 3 H.K.O on neutral damage. Ice beam is for opposing Ground-types, also giving me a 1 H.K.O to those paraflinching Togekiss after Stealth-Rock damage. Focus Blast 3 H.K.O Umbreons and 1 H.K.O. Bisharp and Sharpeedo.

    Evs and Nature: Hp over speed because I don't want to lose Bulk. Modest nature for added power.

    [​IMG]
    Vindication(Rotom-Heat) @ Choice Specs
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SpAtk / 4 SpDef/ 252 Spe
    Nature: Modest (+SpAtk, - Atk)
    Moveset:
    ~Volt Switch
    ~Overheat
    ~Hidden Power Grass
    ~Trick

    Moveset and Contribution: Those are not oven-mitts, those are boxing gloves! Rotom-H provides much needed type coverage to the team, being able to take out Bulky water types like Slowbro and Milotic. The massive damage he would take from Stealth Rock makes me play him with caution as a revenge killer.
    A master of gorilla tactics, Rotom-H goes in for the kill with STAB + Super-Effective Volt Switch, if I don't get the kill I switch to one of my walls and Toxic / Will-o-Wisp stall till I do. Overheat is sadly the only STAB Fire move available to this WW2 Oven of death, which further emphasises the hit and run tactic. HP Grass Gives me good coverage on Ground Types, usually giving me a 2 H.K.O. it's also my "Safe-go-to" move in case I predict my opponent of switching to a ground type to eat up an expected volt-switch. Trick is to hinder Clerics and Eviolite holders (again, I'm looking at you Gligar my bane). Nearing the end of the match Trick also provides a safety-net in the means of Locking my opponent into a move while liberating Rotom-H to freely use his moveset to my greater benefit.

    Evs and Nature: Typical sweeper EVs, Speed and SpAtk optimized. Modest for more powerful hits, I found that the lost of dmg from being Timid was not worth it.

    [​IMG]
    Grace (F) (Umbreon) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Synchronize
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpDef
    Nature: Calm (+SpDef, - Atk)
    Moveset:
    ~Toxic
    ~Wish
    ~Heal Bell
    ~Protect

    Moveset and Contribution: The first rule of Umbreon is: You do not underestimate Umbreon. The second rule of Umbreon is: YOU. DO. NOT. UNDERESTIMATE Umbreon. This beautiful creature has been my favorite Pokemon, along side Suicune, since Crystal and I have to say it has never disappointed me. As a mix wall and cleric Umbreon proves to be the most versatile of them all. I can't count the times where it was only Umbreon pitted against 3 of my opponents pokemon and she won me the match. Hands down, Umbreon and Suicune are the stars of this show. So much so the team is named after her unexpected destructive power.

    Evs and Nature: I've concentrated on making her a mixed wall, allowing me to switch in to oncoming attacks such as Stone Edge with minimal damage intake. Bold is a necessity for that.

    [​IMG]
    Templar (M)(Hitmontop) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 200 SpDef
    Nature: Impish (+Def, -SpAtk)
    Moveset:
    ~Rapid Spin
    ~Toxic
    ~Close Combat
    ~Foresight

    Moveset and Contribution: With all the love and high-esteem I hold the entire team, Hitmontop is the bastard child I never wanted but am forced to have. Considering my matches are very long, entry hazards would ravage my team so Rapid Spin is a must. There are other rapid spinners in the tier, such as Blastoise (but I allready have Suicune) and Sandslash (I have Nidoqueen), but then I wouldn't have a balanced Type structure for the team.
    With that said, He's not half bad. He can take a hit and drain away with Toxic and Sucker Punch and after the entry hazard pokemons have been taken out I always death slaughter him for a safe switch in.

    Evs and Nature: The 56 evs into defense let me take an arial ace from Mienshao to allow me to use toxic or rapid spin before dying, also makes it a mix wall. Impish is to intensify the defense boost.

    [​IMG]
    Agnos (Suicune) @ Chesto Berry
    Ability: Pressure
    EVs: 252 HP / 248 Def / 8 SpDef
    Nature: Bold (+Def, - Atk)
    Moveset:
    ~Scald
    ~Hidden Power Electric
    ~Calm Mind
    ~Rest

    Contribution, EVs, Nature and Moveset: The bulwark of the team... I can't find words to describe my love for this pokemon. Its pure Water typing is amazing, as it gives it few weaknesses and a very wide range of neutral coverage with its STAB moves.
    You MIGHT think, Oh easily killed by Rioku, Roserade or Zapdos, but to you I say think again! EVs: I've sacrificed SpAtk evs for resilience, and after two calm minds those thunderbolts and megadrains are a lot less threatening than you might think. I've set up 4x Calm Minds to a Zapdos, and laughed as Thunderbolts did 8% hp dmg while the LifeOrb hit Zapdos for 10%. The HP evs are necessary for the bulk.
    Modest gives me some added SpAtk.
    Moveset: Generally I do atleast 1 Calm Mind before I start attacking, Blastoise does out run me and he usually carries Roar (priority -6) so that's why I carry HP Electric which hits it for 40% HP before he gets the Roar out.
    Rest Allows me to set up Calm Mind worry free against a wall that would see me die to Toxic. After I've set up 6x Calm Minds I don't fear anything, and will freely rest even with out Chesto Berry. Scald Is the obvious move for STAB, because of 30% of burn which can hinder physical sweepers like noisy DD Kingdras.

    Last thoughts:
    I'm open to all suggestions of improvement, my biggest draw backs have been:
    +:Hitmontop, I just don't feel like he carries his weight of occupying a slot well enough. Anything to improve him, or a different rapid-spinner are greatly appreciated.
    +:Victini, this thing just tares through me. I normally lose one or two of my pokes before I can take him out. So tips on how to handle him with this team would be great.
    +:Sigilyph with Magic Guard, if I've lost my Rotom-H and Sableye this poke will humiliate me and ravage my team as if it were wet cloth.

    I do hope you enjoy my team and looking foward to reading your comments and suggestions. Thank you!
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2013
  2. insanejames

    insanejames Unorthodox Trainer

    im probability not the best person to answer this but i will try anyway

    you team looks soild i like it

    as for Hitmontop there is also Claydol but like you said you already have Nidoqueen

    Sableye set look good but one must be careful of Taunt as it will shut it down completely this would alsorun true for Umbreon
    you could run Foul Play on Sableye but not sure it it would be worth it in the UU

    i did some research on your Victini problem and found these are your best bets Rhyperior, defensive Arcanine, and defensive Swampert, but Suicune should be able to cut it (unless it has Bolt Strike (it probley will))

    well i hope this helps
     
  3. T-Bolt

    T-Bolt Electrifying.

    Well, this teams got pretty good synergy, but I think it could be improved a bit-

    I think trick on Sableye with the Choice specs isn't very useful, as it forces Sableye to use trick on the first turn of battle to use its other moves. Seismic toss or Foul Play would be a better option, and using Leftovers instead of Choice specs.

    Seeing that a majority of your team is walled by Rest Snorlax, I'd suggest using Close Combat on Hitmontop over Foresight or Toxic. Close combat 2HKOs Snorlax even with no offensive EVs, and if your fighting Curselax, it should 2HKO after stealth rock damage. (not sure though)

    Hope this helps!
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2013
  4. AdrianPKM

    AdrianPKM New Member

    @ T Bolt- Tried out the new sableye and it's amazing, it runs so much smoother than before. It's true, I did put a lot of stress into it forcing it to trick from the get go. I had it set up like that because I was scared of physical sweepers.
    Hitmontop has not gotten the chance to face off against snorlax yet, but as soon as I do I'll test out 2 HKO Close Combat, I gave up Toxic for it since I need foresight to gurantee a rapid spin. :] I'm sure if it doesnt work the first time all I have to do is play with evs or nature!

    @Insanejames - It's because Victini carries Bolt Strike that it eats through me. That pokemon is just monstrous. What I do for now is toxic stall him with umbreon.
     
  5. CedOmega

    CedOmega 4570-7932-5223

    Hello AdrianPKMN, cool Stall UU team you've got here.

    First, looking at the team, I found that Sableye's current set is illegal, as Seismic Toss is only available to Sableye via FR/LG tutors. Trick is the superior replacement, especially when holding items like Lagging Tail, Ring Target, Flame Orb, Iron Ball or Sticky Barb. Night Shade is also a solid option for inflicting an assured 100 Hp damage to the opposing team. Also, for all around bulk, I suggest using an alternative spread of 252 Hp/ 120 Defense/ 136 Sp.Defense with a Calm nature.

    ;302;
    Sableye@Lagging Tail/ Sticky Barb/ Leftovers
    Trait: Prankster
    Calm nature
    252 Hp/ 120 Defense/ 136 Sp.Defense
    Trick/ Night Shade, Will-o-Wisp, Taunt & Recover

    Next, I notice a huge Victini weakness. Like my UU teams, you could opt for a Bold Suicune set since you are currently already running a CM+ RestChesto set. This change will help with your team's efforts to put a stop Victini in its tracks.

    ;245;
    Suicune@Chesto Berry
    Trait: Pressure
    Bold nature
    252 Hp/ 248 Defense/ 8 Sp.Defense
    Scald, Hidden Power(Electric), Calm Mind & Rest

    Next, you may also want to try an alternative set for Umbreon as well. Dividing its EVs to have 128 Evs in each defense does not add on to its overall bulk, contrary to popular belief. An alternate spread of 252 Hp/ 4 Defense/ 252 Sp.Defense should suffice, as you have Sableye whom can cripple physical attackers with Will-o-Wisp, so Umbreon need not worry about them much.

    ;197;
    Umbreon@Leftovers
    Trait: Synchronize
    Calm nature
    252 Hp/ 4 Defense/ 252 Sp.Defense
    Wish, Heal Bell, Protect & Toxic

    As of now, it's all I can see that could possibly help at the moment. Best of luck with the team and I hope this was of some help. :D
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2013
  6. AdrianPKM

    AdrianPKM New Member

    @Ced0Omega - Big improvement on the Sableye, Lagging tail ruins those Choice Scarf users and gives me a great advantage! I miss taunt, though. Specially against Gallade and Dusclops, but I manage well with out it.
    Suicune is taking physical hits a lot better than before, and With 2 CM his SpDef is high enough to tolerate Thunder/Thunderbolt and Giga Drain.
    Victini still takes out my sableye, but now that it has Lagging tail I can take it out with Earth Power Nidoqueen! Which is HUGE for me.
    Using Umbreon solely as a special wall feels odd, but being able to Safely Switch in to an oncoming Fire Blast from Chandalure also makes me feel very comfortable.

    Over all I feel the team has greatly improved!
    Thank you so much for your input! ;D
     
  7. SquirtleSquad626

    SquirtleSquad626 New Member

    First off, I'd like to say that you and I sound very similar in that we have been playin this game since it was considered cool, and we have similar taste in pokemon (umbreon and suicune are two of my all time favs)AND playstyle. Walls, Tanks, and Clerics over sweepers is risky today, however, but your team looks well suited to outstand most threats. It looks like Hitmotop is replaceable, and you might consider rapid spin on forretress or armaldo. the set might look like this:

    forretress@ leftovers
    Ability- Sturdy
    -Toxic
    -protect
    -spikes/toxic spikes
    -explosion/pain split
    The EV spread, nature, and moves would be up to how you want him to function. Hope this helps:)


    Also, purely informational, I have a great Umbreon playset that you might like to see.
    Umbreon@ leftovers
    Synchronize
    Calm nature
    EV: 252def, 132spdef, 122hp
    -toxic
    -protect
    -foul play
    -wish
    This set plays like a better mixed wall and also a potent toxic staller and sweeper. with toxic, protect, and wish she can literally stay alive almost forever, and foul play is for those who think they can set up on and take advantage of her "lower" defense. let them do a dragon dance or swords dance and get eaten alive by the unexpected foul play, using their own attack stats and boosts against them. also keeps umbreon from being taunt bait:) hope this was interesting to ya!
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2013
  8. Moog2

    Moog2 Must stay awake...

    Right, this entire post is going to be dedicated to the Victini problem, I think.

    You can actually handle it fairly well with Suicune, even better if you drop Hidden Power Electric for Sleep Talk and Chesto Berry for Leftovers, which is certainly something I might recommend.

    First, some damage calcs, in case you aren't aware of them (note that these do not include Leftovers recovery, which is something I'm suggesting; the Jolly Life Orb variants are dealt with better that way):

    Choice Banded 252+ Bolt Strike vs. Your Suicune -> 63% - 74%
    Choice Banded 252 Bolt Strike vs. Your Suicune -> 57% - 67%
    Choice Scarfed 252+ Bolt Strike vs. Your Suicune -> 42% - 50%
    Choice Scarfed 252 Bolt Strike vs. Your Suicune -> 38% - 45%
    Life Orb 252+ Bolt Strike vs. Your Suicune -> 54% - 64%
    Life Orb 252 Bolt Strike vs. Your Suicune -> 50% - 58%

    Now, I would put up damage calcs for your Nidoqueen as well (assuming you're bold enough to switch it in on a predicted Bolt Strike), but the only variants that don't have a chance to OHKO with V-Create are the Scarfed ones, which will outspeed and finish you off on the next turn anyways, despite the drop.

    In any case, if you have rocks on the field, +1 Suicune has a chance to KO. +2 will always KO. Heck, +2 has a chance to KO without rocks.

    This means, essentially, that is Suicune can get in for free, it can tank a hit and either a) Rest off the damage, b)CM on the switch, or c) hit it with a Scald.

    If you can get rid of its Band with Sableye, you can even handle that variant.

    So, I suppose the suggestion here is, overall, to simply lose HP Electric in order to allow Suicune to switch in on Victini repeatedly. If you can, as you pointed out, get off a Trick with Sableye, you can even set up on it, as they'll be doing the same damage as the scarfed variant.

    I think the overall increased survivablility this will give Suicune is a nice thing, and despite the fact that you'll no longer dent Roaring Blastoise, I think this guy might serve your team better.

    Or you can ignore the suggestion entirely, it's up to you. ^_^

    Another issue- and I mean, like a massive issue- is ChestoRest DD Kingdra, my favourite set to run.

    Though I'll let you know how your might be able to handle it, once I come up with something.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2013

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