Weird moves certain Pokemon can or cannot learn

[Captain Jigglypuff]

That is a question I have been wondering since gen 1. Why they keep not making it part of its level up moveset? it basically is its most signature move and yet its TM or nothing in a lot of games.

Another one I'll never get is why Galarian Stunfisk doesn't have any good damaging options for most of typings it changes to via mimicry and even the one it does (outside z-a) is Snap Trap which is pretty bad. Even its steel options are pretty limited to moves like metal claw. Considering it is related to an Electric type in gen 8 it could have at least keep Spark as an egg move (like its unova form gets) but it doesn't. I know terrain pulse was supposed to be its option but that's a special move.

What confuses me the most is why Snap Trap wasn’t given to Carnivine in SV. The move’s description fits the Pokémon perfectly, it’d be STAB, and the move still exists in the coding of SV. Plus it’s not like Carnivine will suddenly become OP as Snap Trap deals about as much damage as most of the other binding moves. It’s based on a Venus fly trap which is famous for snapping itself shut when it catches prey.

 

[Luthor]

What confuses me the most is why Snap Trap wasn’t given to Carnivine in SV. The move’s description fits the Pokémon perfectly, it’d be STAB, and the move still exists in the coding of SV. Plus it’s not like Carnivine will suddenly become OP as Snap Trap deals about as much damage as most of the other binding moves. It’s based on a Venus fly trap which is famous for snapping itself shut when it catches prey.

Well the move certainly suits it but IIRC Carnivine wasn't in SV. It was in legends arceus and BDSP though so they could have done it then though legends arceus misses a lot of moves (for practical reasons I assume) and BDSP could have but being mainly a remake I guess they didn't think it worthwhile. I could easily see it in a later game if carnivine makes the dex (especially if Stunfisk also does).

 

[Victreebong]

Galarian Stunfisk is a hot mess. Probably because the original Stunfisk is an even hotter mess. It was created to be the flattest Pokémon, the only reason they gave it Ground/Electric is for in-game balancing, the dummy still has Limber, yet it has record popularity in Japan. A serendipitous playboy.

Before they fix Galarian Stunfisk, they need to replace Limber on the OG. My vote goes for Serene Grace. Admit it; you want to see Serene Grace on Stunfisk. Also, put Jaw Lock on Galarian Stunfisk.

 

[Luthor]

Galarian Stunfisk is a hot mess. Probably because the original Stunfisk is an even hotter mess. It was created to be the flattest Pokémon, the only reason they gave it Ground/Electric is for in-game balancing, the dummy still has Limber, yet it has record popularity in Japan. A serendipitous playboy.

Before they fix Galarian Stunfisk, they need to replace Limber on the OG. My vote goes for Serene Grace. Admit it; you want to see Serene Grace on Stunfisk. Also, put Jaw Lock on Galarian Stunfisk.

Weirdly I wouldn't go for Serene Grace (though it would be a good option). If it was up I'd want to give Unovan Stunfisk Electric surge to replace limber. Mostly because outside of the legendary pokemon the only one that gets electric surge is Pincurchin.

As for Jaw Lock it does surprise me Galarian Stunfisk doesn't get it. It does suit it perfectly. I'd also add Iron head/Gyro Ball to its moveset. It needs a good steel physical option as well and I could see it doing either (but Gyro ball is probably easier to visualize).

 

[Pokefan_1987]

Weirdly I wouldn't go for Serene Grace (though it would be a good option). If it was up I'd want to give Unovan Stunfisk Electric surge to replace limber. Mostly because outside of the legendary pokemon the only one that gets electric surge is Pincurchin.

As for Jaw Lock it does surprise me Galarian Stunfisk doesn't get it. It does suit it perfectly. I'd also add Iron head/Gyro Ball to its moveset. It needs a good steel physical option as well and I could see it doing either (but Gyro ball is probably easier to visualize).

As much as i don't care much about it is odd that a trap heavy version like Galarian Stunfisk doesn't get spikes. The japanese name means caltrop and those are usually made out of minerals like rock and metal. It would be fitting since they can get the dreaded stealth rock move.

 

[Captain Jigglypuff]

Well the move certainly suits it but IIRC Carnivine wasn't in SV. It was in legends arceus and BDSP though so they could have done it then though legends arceus misses a lot of moves (for practical reasons I assume) and BDSP could have but being mainly a remake I guess they didn't think it worthwhile. I could easily see it in a later game if carnivine makes the dex (especially if Stunfisk also does).

I keep thinking Carnivine is in SV in the DLC. Specifically Kitami. I’m not sure why I keep thinking it’s found in SV.

 

[Luthor]

Ok here's one I feel like must be an oversight. High Horsepower is a TM in scarlet and Violet and a lot of Pokemon can learn the move including Kantonian Golem and Alolan Graveler which all makes sense except.......Alolan Golem cannot learn the move by TM. In order for it to get the move it has to learn it by TM prior to be being traded and then evolving.

 

[Pokefan_1987]

It's probably ancient design by now but why do pokemon like Shiftry stop getting grass moves after Nuzleaf has evolved. Nuzleaf's Leaf Blade is locked at level 57.
Relying on a move relearner in every game after gen 3 is just odd for poor Shiftry. I don't remember other victims that are like this ?
In Gen 4 Leafeon doesn't learn any grass moves after Giga Drain and Leaf Blade is level 71

 

[Luthor]

It's probably ancient design by now but why do pokemon like Shiftry stop getting grass moves after Nuzleaf has evolved. Nuzleaf's Leaf Blade is locked at level 57.
Relying on a move relearner in every game after gen 3 is just odd for poor Shiftry. I don't remember other victims that are like this ?
In Gen 4 Leafeon doesn't learn any grass moves after Giga Drain and Leaf Blade is level 71

Yeah that's kind of weird now you mention it.
Looking at the other gens it got slightly better (if I have this right)
Gen 5 believe Leaf Tornado at level 19 and Leaf storm 49
In gen 6 leaf tornado at level 20 and leaf storm at level 49
in gen 7 it got leaf tornado at level 20 and leaf storm at level 49
in gen 8 it got Leaf Tornado by evolution.
In gen 9 it got Leaf Blade by evolution

Which isn't nothing but it is somewhat limited for Grass moves and non move reminder in general. (Though in the later games the move reminder became a lot easier). As for why it happened my suspicion is that a lot of early stone evolutions the Pokemon they evolve into have very few moves naturally as I think the intent was to encourage people not to evolve their Pokemon until they had already learned more moves. Raichu has something similar where it learns about 4 moves in several gens (unless it got them as Pikachu) and while it now gets a lot more moves by move reminder they still don't get that many level up moves.

 

[J. D. Guy]

Ice Punch on Wooper is weird because it has no arms

It probably would be depicted using its tail to execute an Ice Punch attack, like how Double-Slap is frequently depicted using the Pokemon's tail when they don't have hands but can learn the move.

 

[MinorMash31]

It probably would be depicted using its tail to execute an Ice Punch attack, like how Double-Slap is frequently depicted using the Pokemon's tail when they don't have hands but can learn the move.

Yeah, but its not really a "punch" at that point...
Also, how come Gardevoir can learn punching moves like Fire Punch and Thunder Punch? It has like the smallest arms ever. Did it forget that it's a special attacker?

 

[Luthor]

Yeah, but its not really a "punch" at that point...
Also, how come Gardevoir can learn punching moves like Fire Punch and Thunder Punch? It has like the smallest arms ever. Did it forget that it's a special attacker?

No it didn't forget. Those moves just used to be special moves. As mentioned earlier Gardevoir and it's pre-evolutions have had thunder punch, fire punch and Ice punch since gen 3 (e.g https://www.serebii.net/attackdex/firepunch.shtml ). One reason that it got those is that prior to gen 4 those were special moves. As such they were a lot more useful at the time. But the same gen once they stopped being useful Kirlia gained an alternative evolution in Gallade who could make use of Physical moves. So it just stuck around (especially as Pokemon could be transferred forward with those moves) it's a bit like Alakazam which is now terrible at using the elemental punches but they used to be really good.

 

[MinorMash31]

No it didn't forget. Those moves just used to be special moves. As mentioned earlier Gardevoir and it's pre-evolutions have had thunder punch, fire punch and Ice punch since gen 3 (e.g https://www.serebii.net/attackdex/firepunch.shtml ). One reason that it got those is that prior to gen 4 those were special moves. As such they were a lot more useful at the time. But the same gen once they stopped being useful Kirlia gained an alternative evolution in Gallade who could make use of Physical moves. So it just stuck around (especially as Pokemon could be transferred forward with those moves) it's a bit like Alakazam which is now terrible at using the elemental punches but they used to be really good.

Ah this makes sense. I forgot that gen 3 had a weird thing with special and physical attacks, like how certain typed moves were classified as physical, like the fighting type, and how the dark type was classified as special. I guess Gardevoir was one step ahead of me.

 

[Luthor]

I've mentioned before that I find it a bit weird that Inteleon despite being based on a James Bond like spy doesn't get any fighting moves (aside from vacuum wave) . Which I do still think it should get some. Especially moves like Low Kick or Low Sweep which are precise hits which I think suit it. I think it also should get some more deceptive and dark moves like switcheroo, Foul Play or Knock off to represent certain actions a spy might do.

 

[Victreebong]

They should bring back Karate Chop just because of Inteleon. Switch it up a bit and cause sleep 20% of the time, but keep all the other things about it. Just like a neck chop, or “tap on the head”.

 

[Luthor]

They should bring back Karate Chop just because of Inteleon. Switch it up a bit and cause sleep 20% of the time, but keep all the other things about it. Just like a neck chop, or “tap on the head”.

They'd probably also have to give it the Machop line (givoen Machop has it in its name) but a fun concept regardless.

Another move that i've often found to be a weird miss is Coil. Coil can be learnt by most snake Pokémon like and Pokémon with a similar body type like Furret and Orthworm (as an egg move) . However Onix and Steelix have never been able to use the move even as an egg move. Now that things like the mirror herb exist (so a lack of Pokémon to give it the move isn't an issue) I do find it weird neither of these snakes can get the move by any means.

 

[Pokefan_1987]

They'd probably also have to give it the Machop line (givoen Machop has it in its name) but a fun concept regardless.

Another move that i've often found to be a weird miss is Coil. Coil can be learnt by most snake Pokémon like and Pokémon with a similar body type like Furret and Orthworm (as an egg move) . However Onix and Steelix have never been able to use the move even as an egg move. Now that things like the mirror herb exist (so a lack of Pokémon to give it the move isn't an issue) I do find it weird neither of these snakes can get the move by any means.

Maybe because Onix and Steelix have Curse as a option. They do the same boosts. Coil just adds accuracy while Curse lowers speed.
But they don't have Rock Polish instead and can't summon sandstorm.
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This makes Sand Force ability on Mega Steelix making is mostly useless. In story mode you get most of the mega stone so late or hidden and requires team knowledge about sandstorm.