What do you Dislike about SM **Possible Spoilers**

[potat_lasaro]

We all know that the latest Pokemon Anime Series: Sun and Moon is the most controversial and dividing among the fanbase, with some loving it while others not so much. I was just curious as to what aspects of the series you don't really care for. Please, do not turn this into a flame war or try and turn this into bashing another series. In fact, I don't want people to bash SM, just to give honest opinions about what they feel hasn't worked for the series and how it could be improved (if possible).

If this is in the wrong section, I'm sorry and could a mod move it if it is.

I'll start off.

1) The Redesign. Now, when Ash's latest redesign was shown, I was a huge hater of it (still am to this day, but I don't complain about it anymore). My biggest problem is how jarring it looks for Ash, Jessie and James, especially since you could take all the new characters introduced in SM, place them into another series and they wouldn't stick out. This isn't the case for the three mentioned above. They stick out and honestly, hurt my eyes. I get why they were done (for an easier way to have fluid animation) but that doesn't make it any less jarring.

2) Pacing. The series has had awful pacing in my opinion. The fact we've spent the first 30 episodes on Melemele only to return back from Akala after SM 37. They spent 7 (technically 8 if we count SM 11) on one Island, getting past all three trials and a grand trial in the process. It started with great pacing, having the first trial in SM 9 and I'm hoping it can create a decent sense of pacing with the start of the upcoming arc. I'm not looking for XYZ level pacing, just something similar to SM 1- SM 12 level of pacing where the characters seemed to rotate focus along with Ash doing a trial.

3) Lack of battles. SM has had a noticeable drop off in completed battles compared to previous series with there being only 17 battles through 43 episodes (I didn't count little scuffles with TR or TS outside of SM1 and SM 12. I also included battles like Rockruff vs Magmar). Though, what we do get are beautifully animated such as the Steelex vs Turtonator battle from the latest episode. I just wish we got a few more, even if they were just between Ash and his classmates.

4) The School. It feels like a cheap plot device sometimes and it could be used better. For example, why not introduce one of the other classes? It could easily give us a way to have competitions between the classes such as a battle tournament or even something similar to the summer camp arc from DP. But instead, it seems to just be a gathering place or used as an excuse to have a CoTD (baseball filler) be involved.

So, like I said, please no flaming, bashing, or complaining about past series but feel free to post your opinions of what could be done better in SM.

 

[Dragalge]

So, like I said, please no flaming, bashing, or complaining about past series but feel free to post your opinions of what could be done better in SM.

Yes because that totally won't happen.

Probably my only complaints thus far is the lack of the Darkinium Z not being used yet by TR and the quickness of the Akala arc. Other than that, I'm loving the series so far with only tiny nitpicks here and there. Especially the personality of some of the Pokemon and characters!

 

[Akkipeddi]

We all know that the latest Pokemon Anime Series: Sun and Moon is the most controversial and dividing among the fanbase, with some loving it while others not so much. I was just curious as to what aspects of the series you don't really care for. Please, do not turn this into a flame war or try and turn this into bashing another series. In fact, I don't want people to bash SM, just to give honest opinions about what they feel hasn't worked for the series and how it could be improved (if possible).

If this is in the wrong section, I'm sorry and could a mod move it if it is.

I'll start off.

1) The Redesign. Now, when Ash's latest redesign was shown, I was a huge hater of it (still am to this day, but I don't complain about it anymore). My biggest problem is how jarring it looks for Ash, Jessie and James, especially since you could take all the new characters introduced in SM, place them into another series and they wouldn't stick out. This isn't the case for the three mentioned above. They stick out and honestly, hurt my eyes. I get why they were done (for an easier way to have fluid animation) but that doesn't make it any less jarring.

2) Pacing. The series has had awful pacing in my opinion. The fact we've spent the first 30 episodes on Melemele only to return back from Akala after SM 37. They spent 7 (technically 8 if we count SM 11) on one Island, getting past all three trials and a grand trial in the process. It started with great pacing, having the first trial in SM 9 and I'm hoping it can create a decent sense of pacing with the start of the upcoming arc. I'm not looking for XYZ level pacing, just something similar to SM 1- SM 12 level of pacing where the characters seemed to rotate focus along with Ash doing a trial.

3) Lack of battles. SM has had a noticeable drop off in completed battles compared to previous series with there being only 17 battles through 43 episodes (I didn't count little scuffles with TR or TS outside of SM1 and SM 12. I also included battles like Rockruff vs Magmar). Though, what we do get are beautifully animated such as the Steelex vs Turtonator battle from the latest episode. I just wish we got a few more, even if they were just between Ash and his classmates.

4) The School. It feels like a cheap plot device sometimes and it could be used better. For example, why not introduce one of the other classes? It could easily give us a way to have competitions between the classes such as a battle tournament or even something similar to the summer camp arc from DP. But instead, it seems to just be a gathering place or used as an excuse to have a CoTD (baseball filler) be involved.

So, like I said, please no flaming, bashing, or complaining about past series but feel free to post your opinions of what could be done better in SM.

Well, you've nailed everything that I wanted to say. But to add to that, this might he unpopular, but I actually don't care for majority of the characters as well in this series. I'm not a fan of goofy Ash (though I'm kind of thankful that they've toned that down slightly recently), and barring Kiawe (who I really think is a great character), I'm not liking the others much. Sophocles is pointless, and I personally found his two focus episodes 26 and 41 very average. Lana, even with good focus, is just very bland to me, and the worst handled is Mallow. I like Mallow's personality, but she's been heavily sidelined, and lastly, I'm pretty unimpressed with anime Lillie, with her focus episodes all feeling very same-y. Anyway, for Lillie, with the start of AF now, that's all going to change, and she's definitely going to be the main star, so I'll probably get a chance to change my opinion about her.

Oh, and to add on, as Dragalge said, I'm quite disappointed that they've not explored anything regarding Trio's Darkinium-Z. Even if it's too soon to give them a Z Ring, atleast explore more, and show them actually putting in effort to try and get that Z Crystal to work. It feels like they've absolutely forgotten that they even have a Crystal. And adding to that, I'm extremely disappointed that Team Skull have been so underutilized. They're essentially Alolan TRio, and are hilarious, so I would really like to seem them more.

 

[potat_lasaro]

Yes because that totally won't happen.

Probably my only complaints thus far is the lack of the Darkinium Z not being used yet by TR and the quickness of the Akala arc. Other than that, I'm loving the series so far with only tiny nitpicks here and there. Especially the personality of some of the Pokemon and characters!

I know...wishful thinking....

But right now I'm not worried about the Darkinium Z because we haven't really gotten much out of the TRio that would make them need to use it. I'm hoping it comes into play at some point and wasn't just a red herring with them.

 

[satopi]

I don't like that not only is there a lack of battles and Ash losing at least once but they aren't taking advantage of school tropes since Ash is a student. I wanted to see something funny like Ash bugging Kiawe, Mallow, or Lillie for answers and getting into trouble.

I don't like that most of the setting (at first) were the Pokemon School kids at the beach. And speaking of the kids, I hate that basically ALL of his classmates have to follow what Ash was doing for the day. It was fine when he was the new kid and learning about the area but having 4-5 people watching you do something simple like train, only having 2 people do something of use is unnecessary.

More intimate interactions between the kids. I don't like that we get small moments like Lillie and Mallow or Mallow and Ash do something together and then wait a long gap for them to show that they have a connection. I hear some people mentioning those 3 don't have much of a connection (which I disagree) but I digress.

I don't like some of the silly faces particularly Ash's faces like how they over exaggerate him being dumbfounded.

Pokemon like Steenee and Togedemaru need to do something other than look/sound cute. (I'm really hoping that Lycanroc keeps it's personality)

Mallow needs more focus and I need to find a reason to care about Sophocles.

Akala Island arc was wayyy too short. The pacing is too fast.

Give Lillie (actually everyone but Ash) another goal.

I don't like that they didn't build up Listen and Stoutland's relationship before he died. Not to mention, Litten didn't get any focus since excluding it mastering Fire Fang and teaming up with Rowlet.

The focus is so screwed. Lana and Sophocles keeps getting episodes when Mallow and Kiawe could've gotten some. And most of Lillie's focus episodes are mainly about her trying to touch a Pokemon.

Lack of reoccurring characters (at the moment).

 

[Golden_Latias]

^ Wow, I thought you liked this series. Had a change of heart?

For me, it's pretty much just the worse-than-OS Kanto pacing, lack of battles, and the fact that Mallow needs more episodes. And two out of three of those things are fixable. Otherwise, I'm enjoying the series.

 

[Navin]

We all know that the latest Pokemon Anime Series: Sun and Moon is the most controversial and dividing among the fanbase

AG at the time of its airing, and BW for the most part, were arguably more controversial.

1) The Redesign.

It's a more 'softer' style that allows for more fluid animations and fits the light-hearted tone of SM.

2) Pacing. The series has had awful pacing in my opinion. The fact we've spent the first 30 episodes on Melemele only to return back from Akala after SM 37. They spent 7 (technically 8 if we count SM 11) on one Island, getting past all three trials and a grand trial in the process. It started with great pacing, having the first trial in SM 9 and I'm hoping it can create a decent sense of pacing with the start of the upcoming arc. I'm not looking for XYZ level pacing, just something similar to SM 1- SM 12 level of pacing where the characters seemed to rotate focus along with Ash doing a trial.

It got a bit slow, but it's been picking up with the Totem battle, Olivia battle, Lycanroc evolution, Kanto 2-parter, and now Nebby is appearing. In fact, plenty has happened: Ash completed 2 full trials, Ash got several Z-crystals, Gladion was introduced, all of the classmates have gotten focus (as a single entity, the 'class', has been fleshed out well), Ash has 3 captures (including a special Orangeroc), Nebby/AF are going to be introduced shortly, major continuity with Misty and Brock reappearing, Ash hasn't lost any of his competency and has the attention of Topu Koku.

3) Lack of battles. SM has had a noticeable drop off in completed battles compared to previous series with there being only 17 battles through 43 episodes (I didn't count little scuffles with TR or TS outside of SM1 and SM 12. I also included battles like Rockruff vs Magmar). Though, what we do get are beautifully animated such as the Steelex vs Turtonator battle from the latest episode. I just wish we got a few more, even if they were just between Ash and his classmates.

A lot of the 'padding' battles have cut down for more slice-of-life stuff.

4) The School. It feels like a cheap plot device sometimes and it could be used better. For example, why not introduce one of the other classes? It could easily give us a way to have competitions between the classes such as a battle tournament or even something similar to the summer camp arc from DP. But instead, it seems to just be a gathering place or used as an excuse to have a CoTD (baseball filler) be involved.

Because the show doesn't want to become School Anime #398174, except with pet monsters. The school provides a setting for the classmates to interact, and a fixed location for the slice-of-life episodes.

post your opinions of what could be done better in SM.

Any of the 'flaws' in SM can be forgiven in how they handle things going forward in Years 2 and maybe 3. If the AF arc, Lillie's development, Ash v Gladion rivalry, Ash's team, and 'league' are all handled appropriately (as in shifting things to be more serious/darker when **** hits the fan with the Ultra Beats), then Year 1 of SM succeeded in setting everything up.

Anyway, Mallow and Team Skull could use more love. Also, tone down the extreme emotive faces.

 

[PokemonBattleFanatic-]

• The sh*tty animation
• Ash's regression
• Every character not named Gladion
• Lack of battles
• Lack of dark plots
• No Paul return
• No Charizard return
• No Sceptile return
• No Infernape return

 

[Leonhart]

I don't like the animation change in the SM series. Musashi and even Kojirou to a lesser extent look ghastly in the current style, although I'll admit that certain battle scenes have looked good due to the fluidity.

 

[Ashton Ketchum]

- Horrible not funny jokes (especially this "Jumping the Shark" with Milotic).
- A bunch of disgusting visual humor (those faces... It's surely for kids? If yeas - SM deserve rating R. I even miss to 4Kids).
- Downgrade art style (poor Ash...).
- Because of the points listed, looking at Ash is shameful and painful.
- Lack of epic and pathos.
- Lack of battles.
- Lack of Adventures.
- Bunch of fillers (maybe even more than in original Sailor Moon and Sonic X).
- Potential fail with Lillie's line, like with N (as say PokemonRangerBoy).
- No Hau (he more deserve this silly moments, than Ash).
- No Brock's Croagunk for old joke with Brock and Misty.
And I now try decide - SM is worse than BW. This saga at least kept himself in the hands.

 

[k6666]

only lack of battle ( i really want battle Class so everyone can participate)
interaction with the other student ( it feel like there only one class in this school)
akala pace ( it feels really rush) well if the sun and moon only have 2 year run then is understandable
oh and unpoppular oppinion i enjoyed mallow ( well her personality help her shine even thou she is not in focus) and Soph ( well he have adorable personality, specially charjabug episode)
well i really enjoy the series so far it great, if the execution is good then this series gonna become my favorite

 

[Frozocrone]

There are a few things I'm not keen on but for the most part I really enjoy it.

If I had to pick one thing, it's how it has pretty much split the community. These days it seems like you're not allowed to like certain sagas or things anymore and it's really sad to see because tastes are completely different.

Also the CO thread just got closed so I imagine the mods are keeping a close eye on this thread.

I'll edit this post a bit later on when I've given it a bit more thought on what I don't like.

EDIT: Biggest complaints of SM from me:

1) I am a little disappointed in how Lillie is being handled; that said with the recent episode reveals I'm reserving judgment on her.

2) I love Mallow but she needs an episode without Team Rocket in to show she can hold an episode. Right now she doesn't really do much.

3) Akala trials were rushed, although we may be headed back there with Tapu Lele in SM044. Maybe we're not done with Akala just yet.

4) School seems like a place to hangout and not a school. Granted there are extra curricular trips to places but it doesn't really feel like a school. We've only seen the non-main classes in SM019 and arguably SM042 during the flight to Kanto. Some small tournaments or interactions with classes outside the main cast would be nice to see.

5) Some Pokemon need more spotlight. Steenee, Togedemaru and to a certain extent Shiron, Popplio and Litten need more screentime.

6) Rockruff should never have evolved if it's just going to stay cooked up inside its Pokeball.

 

[Daniel31]

There are a few things I'm not keen on but for the most part I really enjoy it.

If I had to pick one thing, it's how it has pretty much split the community. These days it seems like you're not allowed to like certain sagas or things anymore and it's really sad to see because tastes are completely different.

Also the CO thread just got closed so I imagine the mods are keeping a close eye on this thread.

I'll edit this post a bit later on when I've given it a bit more thought on what I don't like.

I agree with you 100%, especially the part about the community.

Anyway back to the point of this thread, the thing I didn't like, assuming Akala Island is pretty much finished or they're not going back to explore more of it, was how much they rushed that arc. They were still pretty good episodes and I like how other characters were involved in certain Trials, but there was obviously more to do and explore on Akala Island.

I guess a couple other little things to add, would be that Mallow could use a little more focus on her goal and Pokemon, and I wish the Ash vs Gladion battle wasn't interrupted (damn TRio).

 

[Dragalge]

Ash makes a crap ton of silly faces in every series. How the hell is this a criticism now (not saying you can’t criticize this but it did get me wondering)?

 

[potat_lasaro]

Ash makes a crap ton of silly faces in every series. How the hell is this a criticism now (not saying you can’t criticize this but it did get me wondering)?

I can't speak for others, but my issue is the over reliance on them. Past series had them as well, but it wasn't something we would get every episode like we do so far.

If they could cut back on them a little I think people wouldn't be as annoyed by them

 

[Zoruagible]

I don't expect this thread too last long, once the defenders get here anyways.
Anyways where to start....
1. Ash, Jessie, James, and Brock's designs. Every other character looks fine, the animation is NOT my problem. Ash, Jessie, James, and Brock stick out like sore thumbs. Not to mention putting Misty and Brock back in their original outfits.... why not their AG and DP outfits? Or something brand new? We never see Ash wear his older outfits again.

2. How they handle character progression and focus. Not just the characters, but also the Pokemon. Rowlet has gotten every damn battle so far, and Rockruff's had a fair bit of focus too but not constantly like the owl. Meanwhile Litten's had jack and took literally ages just to use a z-move! He doesn't have a crystal he can call his own either. And characters, we keep getting Lana shoved down our throats. She got TWO episodes in a freaking row unfairly! Then she got yet another one not that short ago.... meanwhile Soph, Mallow, and Kiawe are starving for episodes. Kiawe doesn't need them as bad as Mallow and Soph do, but he's only had two to his name. Soph, he's done stuff in his. Catching Charjabug, winning a race.... all you can say Mallow's done is evolve Steenee
And let's not forget about how unfair Lana going straight from a z-ring to having a crystal within two episodes was. Team Rocket got Darknium AGES ago but can't use it! It makes that episode feel pointless! They better get their z-power rings before any other Twerp does.
Litten and Steenee need more time!

3. Lack of battles, unless the TRio are around we barely get any. Ash hasn't lost a single legitimate battle either, which is just annoying. Pokemon is about the battles, not school. This ain't Yokai Snooze. Litten would especially benefit from some onscreen battles.

4. The school. Let's rush right through Akala, the best island in the freaking games to get right back to the most boring island of all. Seriously, why can't the Battle Buffett at least appear if we're stuck on Melemele? Ash would love that, it's his two greatest loves. Akala only getting four episodes was a major disservice to the island, there is SO much they could do there and so much Pokemon left untouched like Dewpider, Passimian, and others.

5. Ash being the butt of jokes.

6. The overuse of 'funny' faces

7. The criminally low use of Gladion and Team Skull. They're all amazing characters.... yet they appear so little. Team Skull's been gone for almost 20 episodes now.

8. No sign of ya boi Guzma yet.

9. No Hau

10. How none of Ash, Brock, or Misty's older Pokemon showed up. Just their OS ones.... we didn't even see Charizard, Kingler, or Snorlax! No Croagunk either... Brock's most famous Pokemon apart from maybe Steelix. Croagunk and Misty double teaming Brock flirting would have been hilarious. And whatever happened to Misty's Azurill?

11. Only using Brock's gag once.....

 

[Thumbs2]

10. How none of Ash, Brock, or Misty's older Pokemon showed up. Just their OS ones.... we didn't even see Charizard, Kingler, or Snorlax! No Croagunk either... Brock's most famous Pokemon apart from maybe Steelix. Croagunk and Misty double teaming Brock flirting would have been hilarious. And whatever happened to Misty's Azurill?

Didn't we see Totodile and Corphish?

 

[Zoruagible]

Didn't we see Totodile and Corphish?

Those were cameos, and Ash wasn't even in that scene.
I'd have liked to see at least one of the AG, DP, BW, or even XY era Pokemon get a scene or moment with Ash.

 

[Janovy]

"XY fan starts an SM bashing thread".

How original for our anime section.

 

[Golden_Latias]

I know I'm doing what the quote in Akkipeddi's signature says here, but the complaint on this thread I've seen come up is not seeing any of Ash's old Pokemon. I didn't see anybody complaining about not seeing any of Ash's old Pokemon in XY(Z). Why is it suddenly a problem in SM?