Why do people think Ash lost his personality in Sinnoh?

[OfCorsola]

I thought Ash lost tons of personality--oh yeah.
It comes to a matter of opinion though, my arguments supporting it:
He's not as funny as he used to be
He's too serious, he may have gotten better in battling (sadly, this was degraded in BW)
There were no more emotional moments, he lost his kind heart, and love. Except, I love how in BW, his personality sparked when he was saving that Tepig.
He's not generous, or overcocky as he was.
He's bland.
That's all I have to say, and I could say the VA..with Sara Natochenny, she really took the personality out of Ash..

 

[Hero of Truth]

For me, Ash hasn't lost his personality, but the problem is that it's... static. It doesn't lead anywhere, it doesn't evolve and neither de-evolve for me. It's just... there for the sake of being there.

 

[PokemonNation2000]

I'd like to add TPCi's script writing, as far as the English dub goes, sort of damaged my impression of Ash in Sinnoh (not that this has been resolved, because it's still present to this day, but I want to bring this up as it is an issue in my book): a lot of the problems I had with DP Ash stem from the English dub, unfortunately (definitely not all of them, but many of them).

Here's some examples of this (and in general, the deprovement in the quality of this aspect of the English dub since TPCi took over from 4Kids, IMO-- just LOOK for Ash lines here, and you'll see what I mean):

Part I: http://bmgf.bulbagarden.net/blogs/66625/my-top-151-worst-pokemon-anime-lines-why-they-suck-60176/
Part II: http://bmgf.bulbagarden.net/blogs/6...-why-they-suck-continued-61788/#comment302364

 

[pokefandt]

I'd like to add TPCi's script writing, as far as the English dub goes, sort of damaged my impression of Ash in Sinnoh (not that this has been resolved, because it's still present to this day, but I want to bring this up as it is an issue in my book): a lot of the problems I had with DP Ash stem from the English dub, unfortunately (definitely not all of them, but many of them).

Here's some examples of this (and in general, the deprovement in the quality of this aspect of the English dub since TPCi took over from 4Kids, IMO-- just LOOK for Ash lines here, and you'll see what I mean):

Part I: http://bmgf.bulbagarden.net/blogs/66625/my-top-151-worst-pokemon-anime-lines-why-they-suck-60176/
Part II: http://bmgf.bulbagarden.net/blogs/6...-why-they-suck-continued-61788/#comment302364

Now this, this is something I kinda have to agree with. It's kind of like the guy playing Anakin from the prequels. He was a decent actor, but the dialogue he was given to work with was just awful. I'd think you like Sarah better if Ash's dialogue was written better.

 

[Blood Red]

I'd like to add TPCi's script writing, as far as the English dub goes, sort of damaged my impression of Ash in Sinnoh (not that this has been resolved, because it's still present to this day, but I want to bring this up as it is an issue in my book): a lot of the problems I had with DP Ash stem from the English dub, unfortunately (definitely not all of them, but many of them).

Here's some examples of this (and in general, the deprovement in the quality of this aspect of the English dub since TPCi took over from 4Kids, IMO-- just LOOK for Ash lines here, and you'll see what I mean):

Part I: http://bmgf.bulbagarden.net/blogs/66625/my-top-151-worst-pokemon-anime-lines-why-they-suck-60176/
Part II: http://bmgf.bulbagarden.net/blogs/6...-why-they-suck-continued-61788/#comment302364

The 'bunch of bad guys' line is reused so often, I bet the VA's don't even have to say that line after the one time they recorded it. I mean, talk about lazy. And lame.

 

[MidnightMelody]

Because as long as Ash is around the anime will continue to have a nostalgic factor with older fans. Plus Ash is an iconic anime figure. Kind of like how Goku is to Dragonball Z or Serena/Usagi is to Sailor Moon. Could you imagine those shows without their main leads? Would they be as popular?

I thought Goku was going to be replaced in DBZ after the Cell Games and the Buu arc would of focused on Gohan. Really do wish that was the route taken. I love Goku but seeing Gohan take over would of been pretty interesting.

 

[PokemonNation2000]

Now this, this is something I kinda have to agree with. It's kind of like the guy playing Anakin from the prequels. He was a decent actor, but the dialogue he was given to work with was just awful. I'd think you like Sarah better if Ash's dialogue was written better.

You mean Hayden Christensen, right? In that case, yeah, I agree.

I'd probably be able to stand her more, honestly, if it wasn't for this...I still honestly think Veronica was a much more fitting actress for Ash in English (given the guy is 10 and he never ages), of course: Sarah would be fine with me if Ash actually got older, but since he hasn't, it distracts and irritates me.

The 'bunch of bad guys' line is reused so often, I bet the VA's don't even have to say that line after the one time they recorded it. I mean, talk about lazy. And lame.

Forget that...I'm not even going to go into, "Nathaniel reminds me o'me/I'm not a noob/Observation! I'm an observer! I'm doin' it" stuff...that really speaks for itself.

I thought Goku was going to be replaced in DBZ after the Cell Games and the Buu arc would of focused on Gohan. Really do wish that was the route taken. I love Goku but seeing Gohan take over would of been pretty interesting.

That would have been better, yeah, and this is coming from someone who loved Goku in the Buu Saga.

 

[Benny™]

I don't know, I kinda like the 'bunch of bad guys' line.

 

[PokemonNation2000]

I don't know, I kinda like the 'bunch of bad guys' line.

Yeah, that one's in both English dubs, actually: I think it just gets old after they never vary it up lol.

 

[Blood Red]

Yeah, that one's in both English dubs, actually: I think it just gets old after they never vary it up lol.

I always thought it killed some of the show's dignity with it. Couldn't they at least call them 'crooks' or 'criminals' once in a while?

 

[chalkus]

What? The Pokemon series is about the Pokemon. The games and manga always go with new protagonists every gen. The anime isn't called, "The adventures of Ash," its called Pokemon. He's obviously stayed this long because of Pikachu but after nearly 20 years its time for the series to move on. I'd wager 75% of the people who watched Kanto in 1998 aren't even watching the anime anymore, so I don't see how nostalgia is helping.

Digimon and Yugioh changed their main characters over the years and both shows are in near obscurity. DBZ and Sailor Moon have not had new material in years and are still very popular. One of the reasons is that people identify with Goku and Serena, the main characters of their respective anime. They were around for hundreds of episodes and were never replaced so why not pokemon? If Pokemon had to axe Ash it should have happened years ago. It's too late now. Ash and Pikachu have star power and are associated with the anime. To move them now would be to risk what is left of their fan base. The pokemon matter but the human characters matter more. No one watches pokemon to see Swellow or Torkoal. Shipping nonsense alone is more important to the anime than any pokemon is, outside of maybe Pikachu.

 

[Navin]

Digimon and Yugioh changed their main characters over the years and both shows are in near obscurity.

Well it's not like Pokemon XY is that popular either. Whenever people talk about ratings here, they keep mentioning how it's been declining or just flat-lined.

DBZ and Sailor Moon have not had new material in years and are still very popular. One of the reasons is that people identify with Goku and Serena, the main characters of their respective anime. They were around for hundreds of episodes and were never replaced so why not pokemon? If Pokemon had to axe Ash it should have happened years ago. It's too late now. Ash and Pikachu have star power and are associated with the anime. To move them now would be to risk what is left of their fan base.

I honestly think Pikachu has more star power just due to marketing potential and the fact that it's a brand mascot. Reducing Ash to recurring character status and introducing a new hero/heroine with a Pikachu might be the way to go.

The pokemon matter but the human characters matter more. No one watches pokemon to see Swellow or Torkoal. Shipping nonsense alone is more important to the anime than any pokemon is, outside of maybe Pikachu.

Do you think so? What matters most is money. Piplup and Oshawott generated a lot of revenue I bet, and explains why they didn't evolve. And shipping isn't that important either, otherwise Pokeshipping would have been canon years back.

 

[CyberCubed]

The Pokemon are the driving force of the anime, not the human characters.

 

[Caseydia]

The Pokemon are the driving force of the anime, not the human characters.

Yeah but I doubt the producers will replace the main character like that after all these years just because you think so. If so than the show will completely change.

 

[Soniman]

The "battle machine" complains about DP Ash were always garbage to me, just because he wasnt as hyper in his OS days doesnt suddenly mean a completle loss of personality, we got see a lot of it during his interactions with Paul and his bond with Chimchar in general. I can't really see him being stagnant since he was STILL advancing as a trainer and a character, he learned a lot of lessons from the various Elite 4 and Cynthia and to great care to analyze his own way of raising and training Pokemon which is, you know, the meat of the franchise.

I just find the vitriol against DP Ash rather bull, he's not my favorite version of the character but he's certainly not what id call some souless machine or something.

 

[chalkus]

What happened to Ash in DP is called growing up. To a large section of the fan base, that apparently is a bad thing.

The Pokemon are the driving force of the anime, not the human characters.

The pokemon are crucial to the anime's success but are not more important than the humans. Ash, Brock and Misty made the anime. Butterfree, Onix and Staryu had nothing to do with it.

 

[CyberCubed]

The pokemon are crucial to the anime's success but are not more important than the humans. Ash, Brock and Misty made the anime. Butterfree, Onix and Staryu had nothing to do with it.

And yet if it were any other 3 different human characters when the show first started....it would make no difference.

 

[Soniman]

And yet if it were any other 3 different human characters when the show first started....it would make no difference.

Can't you say that about anything though?

 

[CyberCubed]

Can't you say that about anything though?

What I was saying though is the entire human cast is interchangeable. Had Ash been retired at the end of Johto or DP it would make no difference.

 

[DaDonYordel]

Nah, Ash just matured like a fine wine aged through generations. Except in the 5th generation where mold suddenly crawled into the wine barrels and spoiled it all. Now they have to start over with a secret batch in case it happens.