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Why is Sinnoh so nostalgic for people?

Discussion in 'General Pokémon Discussion' started by Sham, Jan 1, 2020.

  1. Sham

    Sham Get better soon

    One could argue this for the entire gen 4 games but I see Sinnoh referenced the most when it comes to Pokemon being at it's "peak" or people simply wanting to reminisce about Pokemon. I'm guilty of this as well since despite "improvements" in Pokemon since generation 4 (which is a whole decade) I still find myself playing Platinum the most out of games that followed after.
  2. Gamzee Makara

    Gamzee Makara Let people enjoy things...

    While Sinnoh is currently at most mildy trending due to generational nostalgia pushing, I'd argue that Unova is more commandingly nostalgic due to people never shutting up about N and Team Plasma(Good things but not worth pushing nostalgia on everybody for), water textures, the Pokémon World Tournament(A stupid reason to dislike future gens(The ONE thing I dislike about Chuggaaconroy) and more empty a concept than people realize(Where are Frontier Brains, Elite 4 members, past protagonists and rivals, other notable trainers, past villains who are alive, who are these filler people and what future role will they play, what point does it serve, etc)

    The nostalgia commandos formerly ruled over by Gen I fans are more about forcing people to comply with Gen V nostalgia then Gen IV's branch nowadays.

    I like Sinnoh best due to the Poketch being the best "toolkit" so far and the Underground being the best multiplayer concept as well, but I don't whine about it being the best and bully others into praising it to the rest of people on a site just trying to play games.

    I blame Romhacks, mods, fangames and Nuzlockes using such games for said nostalgia bullying.
    Ignition and Leonhart like this.
  3. Leonhart

    Leonhart Imagineer

    I liked the Gen IV era overall, because I felt that the games released during the DS years [including D/P/Pt and even side games like PMD Time/Darkness/Sky and the second Pokemon Ranger game] were top-notch. As for the Shinou region in particular, I personally felt that it was the largest region even up to this point, so I'm quite fond of it because of its sheer size.
  4. Carrick2097

    Carrick2097 Member

    My love for this gen simply does come from sheer nostalgia- I was just turning 16 when they came out, and am now nearly 29!

    It was an innovative gen at the time IMO. People will always be nostalgic for past gens. I laughed at a comment on YouTube the other day: ‘Is it bad that I’m nostalgic for Pokemon X & Y?’ It made me laugh because that doesn’t seem so long ago- but it’s already been 6 years!
    Sakuyamon and WishIhadaManafi5 like this.
  5. RedJirachi

    RedJirachi Veteran member

    It's been long enough to reach nostalgia. Wait 12 years and we'll be nostalgic for Galar
  6. Ignition

    Ignition Wake me up when get to Sinnoh

    DPP just does something for me no other Pokémon game can do (closest were probably SM/USUM). I played all the DS games in close proximity and yet I always feel the same feeling I felt all those years ago when I got Diamond for the first time. Maybe it’s due to a lot changing for both me and the series since then and how it’s a bittersweet feeling knowing things aren’t going to be the same
    WishIhadaManafi5 likes this.
  7. Xaby

    Xaby Stand up to the Victory

    1) The generation's internet access. Previous titles before were mostly local friends playing and trading, but with DPPt's internet capabilities people became more capable of completing their Pokedex and battling one another. Due to this Pokemon communities swelled and many people became more active than just passive, and started interacting with other people in Pokemon boards such as this one.

    2) The revamped battle system or the physical/special split got a lot of people to battling. Couple that with the previous and this was the time competitive Pokemon really got its stride. Smogon seemed to have lots of changes during this era, for example, because of the very active battle scene.

    3) The legendaries. If I'm not mistaken, Sinnoh had the most number of introduced legendaries in them. And many of them some of the most game changing ones at that time. A ghost dragon? Steel Dragon? The highest base stats that can change its type? And the most annoying grass Pokemon to keep you flinching? There were lots of legendaries around that made you explore the region.

    Not to mention that this was the time download promotions hit their stride, causing more hype and memories for the generation. There were more retail store events and WiFi distributed ones were even better.

    And of course there was Regigigas.

    4) The story. In my opinion this is the one that really made the games so nostalgic. While later games had more fleshed out back stories, Sinnoh had the most mysterious lore around - the Canalave Library stories fuels more than a dozen discussions, conspiracies, and probably a few creepypastas here and there.

    And the story itself was one where you really felt you made a heroic impact. You saved the lake guardians and eventually the aspects of time and/or space. In Platinum you went to a different dimension which you actually interacted with. Add to that the best (and most active in the story) champion ever, and arguably one of the most insane yet successful antagonists in the series and you have one of the most impactful stories in the franchise.

    Not to mention that almost al of those legendaries I mentioned above have stories of their own, and even some of the event ones had their lore and sequence as well. Who could ever forget the Darkrai event where you slept in an ancient inn and woke up in a desolate island?

    Sinnoh is a place rich in lore, and the game event was nothing short of world-changing. This combinations to an epic saga of a story, which you can dive into deeper if you want.

    5) The gameplay. I was playing Platinum a few months back in preparation for Sword and Shield (still go back to it from time to time to RNG shiny the legendaries), and I have to say the gameplay is pretty good. It introduced huge innovations for its time: the return of the day and night cycle, daily and weekly events, and in the case of Platinum, a fully decked out battle frontier island.

    Granted, it starts really, really slow. If you come back from a later experience, the first few chapters of your game will be painstakingly slow, and it won't count against you if you gave up because of that. Those who do push through will be rewarded with a remarkable experience.

    The battles are also pretty hard. Cynthia's battle in particular is very challenging. She will almost always knock out at least one of your Pokemon if you're not overleveled, and for a person doing a no knock-out rule (I reset if I ever had a KO), it took me almost two hours to beat her without losing a party member. That was the hardest challenge I can remember from an NPC in like ever. And this is from a team that was semi-optimized.

    DPPt gameplay still stands out even after almost 20 years, sign of a good design.

    6) And of course we finally had snow. Finally, snow. Sorry RSE, you were the weather generation, but you forgot snow. You snooze, you lose.

    Additionally, the snowy area was the first case of game freak having ghosts interact with you (the chateau ghosts didn't talk to you, they just scared the hell out of you). I didn't recall it when I was a kid playing it, but when I encountered it again after seeing all the ghost tangents in future games, I said: "Oh man, I couldn't believe I missed this."
  8. Bolt the Cat

    Bolt the Cat Bringing the Thunder

    Part of it is the timing, with the game being old enough to be remembered fondly and a remake being potentially imminent. But as far as why it's considered to be the "peak", it goes much further than that. 4th gen is the last game to feel like an overall improvement in the series. The first four generations constantly built on each other without removing much, and each game felt like it was getting bigger and more advanced over time. That all ended with BW, which removed a LOT of features from 4th gen, made the region a lot more linear, and focused on making the game easier for casual players. Most of the design decisions people are sick of in this series now started in BW (or XY which went even further by giving the games bare minimum content). So the main reason a lot of people feel this game is "peak" is because it was the latest and greatest before a major design philosophy shift in the series that spawned a lot of controversy.
    TwilightBlade likes this.
  9. MotostokeOnTrent

    MotostokeOnTrent PokéJungle writer

    We haven't revisited it since - that's 90% of the nostalgia accounted for. No one's really nostalgic for Kanto these days given how often we've been there.

    To be honest, even if I particularly enjoyed Sinnoh I'm not sure I'd want GF investing time and resources into a remake (especially when they should be patching Sword and Shield). The core gameplay experience was pretty well codified as of Gen 3 and a graphical update to Diamond and Pearl seems unnecessary - they still look just fine. I didn't much care for ORAS considering how closely it mirrored RSE, a run-through of which I'd finished a month before.

    Also, Sinnoh just isn't very good (my own taste, of course). Bidoof might be a meme but it's far from the only weak, twee species that litters the region. Kricketot, Cherrim, Burmy, Buneary, Floatzel, reams of useless babies... not again, please.
    Sakuyamon and TwilightBlade like this.
  10. Sketchie

    Sketchie it's about the CUBES

    There was just something beautiful about Sinnoh, and really, Gen 4 as a whole. My personal favorite games are Diamond, Explorers of Sky, and Ranger: Shadows of Almia. I stayed up and played those games until 6 in the morning, and even as a kiddo I valued my sleepy-bye time. Here's why:

    -- The stories hold up really well. Whoever was on their writing team nailed it. Team Galactic is one of the most moving antags to me, there was something so sinister about them that I was so compelled to go after them. The storyline of EoS is the best one Pokémon has ever put out, you really felt like a hero and if you didn't bawl your eyes out when you die and leave your friend behind, you're lying. The characters were so clear and memorable. And, while I know SoA didn't get nearly as much attention, it remains one of my favorite stories to date with the ideals of harmony and overcoming darkness with light. I was enthralled with being a Top Ranger, and it's one of my most re-played games because I can't get enough of it. Speaking of writing, these games are chock full of LORE. There is so much history to them and I, a history dork, will consume it all.
    (It's actually something I missed in XY and SM, there wasn't nearly as much backstuff as the previous games which, I think, is part of the reason they felt so flat. SWSH did better, but I wish there was more.)

    -- Despite these games being 10+ years old, the visuals are still really good, even still breathtaking. Spear Pillar and the Distortion World is just... so... I don't even have words for it, that's how much they struck me. Everything in EoS is so perfect for its setting, so rustic and wistful, and it does a great job of taking you to this other, Pokémon world, especially through its use of color and tone. The market place is bright and warm and homey, and the way they juxtapose the future as cold and grey and hostile was so... just, perfect. On the same coin, the styles have just aged really well. They're nostalgic because they have aged so well. The graphics are crisp, but they still manage to be soft. There is still a focus on patterns to get the point across, like the little funky dots on the grass rather than trying to render and texture grass. You don't get that crispness anymore, it's all soft and bubbly. Sinnoh was a spriter's paradise, and the graphics take you back to a simpler time.


    -- Finally, and what I think is most important: SOUNDTRACK. If Pokémon has succeeded with anything through the years, it's their music and these games are no exception. The sound design and OST shine. They're memorable (very important), and they're fitting. It's music that drives the emotion, that drives the breathtaking, and these games absolutely killed it. This was also while we still had that "video game music" style, as BW marked the departure of that style and more "real" music. Pick anywhere in Sinnoh and it'll be beautiful. The themes were so perfect, and they matched up so seamlessly. I can't list all the themes and bits that I adore because I will end up listing the whole region. EoS had a function called the Shaymin Jukebox where you could listen to all the OST pieces you've unlocked, and it was the best thing, and really, DPPt needs it. I listen to Sinnoh all the time. Also, sound design. Lots of iconic sound effects. And let us not forget the PokéChurch in Hearthome city, where the sound just cut. *chef's kiss*

    … So I didn't mean to write an ESSAY, but in conclusion, Sinnoh (and Gen 4 as a whole) is nostalgic because it's the last region before a major departure. Gen 5 marked a shift in a lot of technical elements, and it started the leaving of the old video game designs. Its graphics and sound are hallmarks of that time before everything started changing. They are good, solid, well-made games, good enough that its flaws are easily looked past. It's iconic. Am I biased? Hell yeah I am, these are my favorite games of all time. But, if it was just because time and also I was a child, I don't think I would replay them so often as a big kid now.
  11. WishIhadaManafi5

    WishIhadaManafi5 Happy Holidays! Staff Member Moderator

    So much all of this. ^

    The Underground is one of my all time favorite parts of that generation and if there ever is a remake, I hope they bring it back.

    Love the story as well.
  12. Dragalge

    Dragalge Lucy Eiscue

    You said a lot of fantastic things about Sinnoh but what do you mean SM didn’t have a lot of backstory? It had plenty of that with the Tapus, UBs, & the Light Trio and overall was the best at that since Unova & Sinnoh. XY’s was pretty weak I agree and SWSH’s lore is still better (not by much) than what was shown in Kalos but Alola’s lore is in no way on Kalos/Galar’s level.

    Also this thread’s question is weird. DP were released over ten years ago. Of course people are going to be nostalgic over it especially if they started in this generation. It’s also happening with BW, especially since that will be ten years old this year. And well Gen 6/7 will follow suit too.
    Pokegirl Fan~ and wolf jani like this.
  13. Sketchie

    Sketchie it's about the CUBES

    Alola's backstory felt forced and crammed to me, like they were trying, but they went way overboard. It didn't feel naturally infused like Hoenn, Sinnoh, or Unova had it. There was so much, and it felt like it didn't really thread together to me. Sinnoh had a ton of lore, but they did a great job at making it all line up well and be relevant. There were so many historical landmarks not only to visit, but actually had a point in the story. I feel like Alola didn't quite make it there. Just because it's there doesn't mean it's good.

    And yes. There will be nostalgia. It is old and has been left untouched for a decade. But... it's good, and that's why it's so nostalgic. Age means nothing to a sub-par game. For example: Explorers of Time/Sky/Darkness is highly regarded and a lot of players nostalgia over it. Gates to Infinity? Not that much younger, but not nearly as impressive, so you don't see that same nostalgia. No one reminisces about the good times in Gates to Infinity, because it was a solidly meh game. Explorers of TSD was fantastic, so it lives on. Same thing here. Kalos will not have the same nostalgia as Sinnoh, because it wasn't as good.
    Sham likes this.
  14. Sham

    Sham Get better soon

    Or maybe you just don’t understand it? OS-XY happened years ago but people mostly focus their nostalgia towards DP from what I’ve seen. Yes people care about other generations but when I see throwbacks to other games it mostly focuses on DPPtt; in comparison I don’t see people discuss GCS, RSE, BWW2 or XY as much. There’s literally a whole twitter page dedicated to discussion Gen 4 and random moments from it.
    Leonhart, Sketchie and Dragalge like this.
  15. Leonhart

    Leonhart Imagineer

    One of the best things about Shinou was the Underground, and it's definitely one of the most exciting activities to do in any core game from my viewpoint. Digging for treasure just never gets old, although I was slightly miffed that the feature never went full-scale with Wi-Fi interactions.
  16. Orphalesion

    Orphalesion Well-Known Member

    I think people are focusing on Gen 4 right now because after ORAS Gen 4 seems like it "should" be the next to receive a remake and people are actively looking, wishing and waiting for it right now as a result.
    wolf jani and MotostokeOnTrent like this.
  17. MotostokeOnTrent

    MotostokeOnTrent PokéJungle writer

    This is like, 90% of the reason. I can't honestly remember DDPt being acutely well-received, though being the first titles on an extremely popular console might account for any feelings of exceptionalism.
  18. RileyXY1

    RileyXY1 Young Battle Trainer

    Mostly hype for future remakes.
    Leonhart likes this.
  19. Ignition

    Ignition Wake me up when get to Sinnoh

    I don't think remakes are the main reason. I'm not going to deny they're a huge factor. I think they have a strong presence in every medium (anime, manga, games). A lot of innovation went into that generation and was also the first generation that took the lore more seriously. Remakes are probably why the nostalgia for these games are more apparent to the general fandom but this mindset is nothing new.
    Leonhart, Sham and Pokegirl Fan~ like this.
  20. WhiteBlair

    WhiteBlair Reporting on-duty in Galar.

    I don't think I'm nostalgic to Sinnoh, but would love a remake as soon as possible (Cynthia <3).

    Most people's first interaction with DP dates back to when NO$GBA; an emulator, was launched. If you're a life-long Pokémon player, outgrown SP after RSE, but can't buy a DS yet on your own, an access to early JPN roms and ability to play on your PC was what made DP really stand out to me back in '06.

    Also, DPPt and HGSS have quality sprites and amazing story with packed side-quests; which I still say have much better graphics than Generation 5. Many people played any of Generation 4 games more than they did for other series. To this day, I probably finished Pt and HGSS around 15-20 times.

    Also important, DPPT were a huge step up from RSE except speed and never felt dated. By the time we had ORAS, we were already in 3D and Hoenn looked like just any coder can create from scratch; no proper animations, no character visualization, extremely-pixelated overworld and etcetera. In 2020, I feel I definitely can play any of Generation 4 series along with Sword and Shield.

    Let's not forget that Cynthia is objectively-considered as the best Champion and featured in other games more than any other; giving us sweet Sinnoh flashbacks. She was in DP, Pt, HGSS, BW, BW2, SM, USUM. It was technically impossible to forget about Sinnoh, even when majority people complained the story mode in XY and ORAS.

    I agree with you, I don't feel nostalgic to Sinnoh at all and that shows how golden that era of Pokémon was. Even anime made such a huge impact; both in JP and DUB (Zoey vs. Nando, Ash vs. GYM Leaders, Ash's league arc., Dawn's contest arc.) and Sinnoh became one of the first regions many people reminisced about in the past decade.

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