Will Alain be disqualified?

[Cetra]

Alain never cheated. He and Charizard won the match legitimately.

Again? Seriously?

 

[Alexander18]

Again? Seriously?

Well he didn't. Alain won using his Charizard with no cheating methods.

 

[Greneuliest808]

Again? Seriously?

It is starting to get worse. I think we should get out of here before this becomes a disaster.

 

[Cetra]

Well he didn't. Alain won using his Charizard with no cheating methods.

I get the feeling our talk from one day before was like a total waste of time if you still bring in your claims of someone winning legitimately while we do not even know what's going on right now.

 

[Alexander18]

I get the feeling our talk from one day before was like a total waste of time if you still bring in your claims of someone winning legitimately while we do not even know what's going on right now.

The episode clearly showed a legit win for Alain and Charizard.

 

[Zard-X]

As far as we know, Alain did win legitimately. We were shown nothing in his match with Ash that indicated foul play, so him cheating is nothing but speculation at this point. There's nothing concrete to back that up, so it's perfectly reasonable to say Alain won the match fairly.

 

[Lux-Argorok]

I really don't see Alain forfeiting the title after watching again. Is it what people want? The forums and the angry salt tell me yes. Is it what will happen? Unlikely. I see Alain asking for a rematch with Ash. Not for the title, but for personal redemption. While I think people are right in that Alain's personality demonstrates that he will feel immense guilt toward what he is doing, I think it's equally in his nature to try and make it right in a way that pleases him. There's likely no rigging, so there's no reason to feel he should outright forfeit the title. What he may feel is that battling Ash helps him see a different possibility for him and Charizard. Thus, by fighting Ash again, he will be able to find a new possibility and move forward post-incident. I could see Alain staking the title on the match at worst, but that's about it. The stripping him of the title due to criminal affiliation sounds plausible though if we relate it to irl sports, but that seems too convenient. We have to look at this from the jaded perspective that they are out to drive every nail they can into the coffin to send Ash running to Alola at top speed. That's what this recent match has told us if anything.

 

[Xenon Blue]

Too little evidence, too much assumption from both sides. This is just going around in circles. I think holding off on this topic is the best idea right now, but what do I know. Maybe you guys find it entertaining to ramble on (because I certainly find it entertaining)

 

[Cetra]

The episode clearly showed a legit win for Alain and Charizard.

Yeah, okay. You really did not care for what people told you and are just repeating yourself, contradictory to some of your posts in the middle where you even tried to show it as an opinion. At least for next time I know I do not need to answer as this is just going to be another circular discussion. And no, it did not show anything clearly.

 

[Alexander18]

Yeah, okay. You really did not care for what people told you and are just repeating yourself, contradictory to some of your posts in the middle where you even tried to show it as an opinion. At least for next time I know I do not need to answer as this is just going to be another circular discussion. And no, it did not show anything clearly.

Don't assume to know me. There would have been evidence of cheating but there wasn't. And the episode did show there was no cheating. No point looking for ways to discredit Alain's win because he won legit.

 

[Cetra]

Don't assume to know me. There would have been evidence of cheating but there wasn't.

I do not need to "assume" anything. I am saying exactly what you did for the last two days. And your argument is exactly the problem. You say "there would have been evidence" but there have not even been new episodes so everything is open right now. As things are right now you did not learn anything from what people were telling you. Instead you stick to that claim you made and sometimes switch to stating it like an opinion just to switch back to the claim again. This leads to nowhere.

 

[Alexander18]

I do not need to "assume" anything. I am saying exactly what you did for the last two days. And your argument is exactly the problem. You say "there would have been evidence" but there have not even been new episodes so everything is open right now.

Alain does not need to cheat to win and he is not that type of trainer. As I said, no point trying to discredit Alain's win because it is legit.

 

[Cetra]

Alain does not need to cheat to win and he is not that type of trainer. As I said, no point trying to discredit Alain's win because it is legit.

No one ever said Alan cheating was the only possible way for some illegitimate. But you do not read our posts and continue so as said, there is no need to have this discussion. It is better for both sides.

 

[Alexander18]

No one ever said Alan cheating was the only possible way for some illegitimate. But you do not read our posts and continue so as said, there is no need to have this discussion. It is better for both sides.

Why does the battle have to be illegitmate? Is it so hard to accept that Alain won that it has to be discredited in some way. I can't buy that for a second unless it appears on screen.

 

[satopi]

Nah, I'm still in the Alan Fan Club. He's an Anti Hero in the anime's perspective but an Anti Villain to the viewers' perspective. I don't see Alan even caring if his title was revoked (if it happened) since he never cared/wanted to be in the League in the first place. I see some people are grasping at straws until proven wrong. It's a possibility that Team Flare/Lysandre Foundation had something to do with the League in terms of monitoring it but the match itself being rigged? No, Ash just wasn't strong enough.

I don't think his title will get revoked just because of the scandal considering he won by being the strongest. Malva would use her job as a reporter to manipulate the media into thinking differently. Turning the tables into saying that Champion Alan is going to save runner-up Ash until she gets exposed for working with the terrorist. or saying runner-up Ash has sacrificed himself to protect us. She may even try to convince the public that Lysandre's speech is true and the vines going everywhere is just the current transition into creating a more beautiful city.

 

[Zard-X]

I do not need to "assume" anything. I am saying exactly what you did for the last two days. And your argument is exactly the problem. You say "there would have been evidence" but there have not even been new episodes so everything is open right now.

But that's why he should have every right to claim the win is legitimate for now. If new information reveals otherwise then that would no longer be the case, but as of right now we've seen nothing that indicated foul play in the match, so as far as we know it was a legitimate win. I hate to do it, but I'm going to use another sports analogy. Lance Armstrong's Tour De France titles were all considered legitimate when he won them. It wasn't until evidence came out that he cheated that we claimed the wins weren't legitimate. It's really no different with Alain. His win is legitimate unless proven otherwise.

 

[DeepSeaDragon]

When exactly have athletes been stripped of titles when it didn't involve cheating? When exactly have they been stripped of titles due to involvement in something that didn't have any relation to that sport. Last I checked, Darren Sharper is still a Super Bowl Champion despite raping numerous women.

And for him cheating to be your main argument you'd actually need evidence to suggest he cheated, none of which exists at this point, so I don't see how you can really sit here and say he should be stripped of his title due to cheating when absolutely nothing suggests he cheated.

Reggie Bush for accepting benefits and profits from NFL agents. Nothing to do with cheating on the field. Countless others btw.

I can tell this conversation is going nowhere fast. I addressed why I argued that pages ago.

 

[Cetra]

Why does the battle have to be illegitmate? Is it so hard to accept that Alain won that it has to be discredited in some way. I can't buy that for a second unless it appears on screen.

Together with some reasons other people stated it is also the fact that the entire battle was totally inconsequential by bringing in a seemingly impossible Pokémon that acted like nothing happened at all during the entire battle. It would make the entire battle pointless, yes even render the battle against the other 5 Pokémon relatively non-sensical as winning against those 5 is not the big achievement when even they are shown as complete garbage compared to his other remaining Charizard X. Ash losing after a relatively close battle would have been a pity but it would at least show some worth behind it. However, as things are now we do not even know how much effort he would need to put in defeating this enemy. There was some tension for a battle that was just presented weird. It is not just that he lost but how he lost.

It wasn't until evidence came out that he cheated that we claimed the wins weren't legitimate. It's really no different with Alain. His win is legitimate unless proven otherwise.

Except that is not how truth works. It is how proving things work. Truth exists before people know of it. Proof just tells people that the truth actually is the truth. It does not magically cause the existence of truth. So if someone who wins illegitimate is not proven to have won illegitimate he has won illegitimately nonetheless. People just do not know it and therefore officially cannot say it. It is a thing of law. It does not mean that in reality that person has not won illegitimately. You just cannot punish a person for that. Just as a murderer is a murderer even if things are not proven. Proof shows existence, it does not create it. And as things are, the truth about what happened in the story already does exist so it is something that should be waited for instead of just saying "okay case closed, we could not prove x so we came to that conclusion".

Unless we see evidence later on, the battle remains legit. Can't give false hope if the win remains legit.

Then you do not know the difference between truth and proof. The absence of proof is no proof for non-existence.

 

[nandermind]

deal with it guys

alan is officially holds the trophy but hasnt being a champ yet

so far champ still diantha

but if alan decided to beat E4 and diantha then success. hes a true champ

so who will have that ticket? ash or alan?

lets see on TFA

i believe one of them should have it

 

[shadowF]

is it said why Ash-Greninja has its forehead glowing red when it does its final attack on Mega Charizard X? I think that would clear some things up.