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XYZ effect on fans and writers. How do you feel?

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I'm pretty sure Cricket is just leaning into the parody now. At least jane is unique.


Well-Known Member
I don't know. Just stated what other people said about XY overall that time, not only about Satoshi.

If you ask me after watching XY, I'd say that "maturity" is kinda overrated? Hence my quotes. Yeah, the art style and the songs were beautiful, but beautiful and mature isn't the same thing. You want a real mature plot? Talk about political, social or ethical issues. (The villiain plot could have some of this, but no more than other seasons, as I can recall.)

The depression arc and the fighting against the Pokégirl isn't really something unseen before for Satoshi, so I wouldn't say that's OOC, but neither that's a mature plot.
i know, was riffin.

The depression arcs usually aren't great but they generally require signifcantly stronger/different stimuli(personal history as opposed to simply losing a battle). Ash flipping out after a routine gym loss to a relative stranger doesn't really make sense when you consider his comaprative lack of reaction to getting knocked out of the unova region(or really all of his league losses) or his lack of reaction to losses to actual rivals further on. Ash flipping out isn't ooc, ash flipping out to that is.


Well-Known Member
Unpopular opinion, but I think that it was wonderful that XY/Z was self contained. It didnt rely on nostalgia to get massive amount of hype.
For example, JN got most of its hype by having old character cameos...XY/Z managed to do it without any.
JN is getting hype because ash is experiencing unprecendented success and people think he might climb the mountain. Doubt anyone bar for hard-core fans care about a misty cameo.


Well-Known Member
The one bonus I see, even for those who hate Ash, is that said series have also been inclined to give the other protagonists similar perks to make the plot flow seem more organic and less like Ash is super endowed. Ash opened those floodgates for several characters, not just himself.

Ash got the regional gimmick, they give it to Kiawe first to establish it, then let the other companions get it.
Ash got an Ultra Beast, Gladion/Lillie later get one.
Ash got a mythical, Gladion and Mallow get one first with Lillie and Goh following later.
Ash became Champion, so free game to make Iris one too, with several other companions also getting some culmination in their goals too.

XY stands out because it's the start of Ash getting special treatment, but none of the other companions get in on it (granted AshGreninja is part compensation for Ash never getting Mega Evolution).
think this is a weakness of s and m to an extent. Ash's "freinds" basically rode "with ash" to success in fields that don't neccesarily make sense for them. Frankly, all of ash's friends working together to get into the final tournament undermines the success they were afforded. No longer a matter of merit or a product of what these characters have done but of "being ash's friend". In-universe it's odd there's no sort of regulation regarding that, out-of-universe it's basically cheating

Pokegirl Fan~

"She can violate my rights"-Brock
xy's corrina-lucario arc took everything away from everyone and everyone away from everything

you and jane owe us everything forever
This arc was terrible. I felt bad for Serena because she was neglected the most during this arc for some obnoxious gym leader and her mega shillcario


Go, my Steady! Mega Shinka!!!
I'm getting tired of it, Serena, amourshipping, XY Ash, and Greninja/Ash-Greninja getting constantly brought up in almost every thread in one way or another tbh.
That part. You cannot escape the frog and amour getting "retconned", Alain, the Kalos loss and Serena when nobody was talking about any of them/that.

I've seen more posts about the frog than Ash vs Cynthia


Well-Known Member
XYZ will forever be my favorite series in the anime (BW comes second).
Love the "mature" stance they took on Ash's story in Kalos.
He got a whole team of flying type Pokemon with Greninja on Pikachu level, that was different
Clemont and Bonnie were the new and improved versions of May/Max.
Serena, the established love interest who knew Ash prior to the show, the only Canon shipping, the only one to actually admit her love for Ash and kiss him goodbye before starting her own life without him.
The battle of Kalos was EPIC.


Well-Known Member
I'm getting tired of it, Serena, amourshipping, XY Ash, and Greninja/Ash-Greninja getting constantly brought up in almost every thread in one way or another tbh.
Quite ironic when most of the times you are the one bringing it up, granted its for the sake of hating on it but that makes it even worse because this certainly adds nothing to the discussion, as someone who has not been here for years, i am seriously amazed you have been doing this for so many years.

Even if every other person in the world stopped talking about anything XY related, you would certainly bring it up.


Kaleido Star FOREVER in my heart <3
XYZ set the standard very high in terms of plot and artstyle and overall quality
It went from epicness to Super Nanny the inappropriate version
I will forever remember this series, its characters and the excitement it generated


Active Member
I don't dislike XY but I can see why the production people and some fans might not like it
The new director of XY has said that XY had pushed certain boundaries for the anime mostly because the target audience is kids

And for many they like the boundaries they pushed ex: the Serena romantic subplot (amourshipping)
I can't find the source but many have repeated that the XY director wanted to appeal to older audiences unlike the previous series
Many have said that XY felt that the characters were more teens, etc which supports that
Things I think XY pushed boundaries on were the “maturity”, tone, and romance, among other things
But I think others didn't like those pushed boundaries
If someone wanted or was expecting a kid show than those aspects being changed would not like XY as much

Or just not like the more mature aspects

And some of those people can also be writers and whoever influences the series

Plus from a marketing and broadcasting viewpoint Pokemon (as a whole) is a kid brand they aren't trying to appeal to critics, teens/adults, etc it's not their target demographic

So there could have been a big enough internal reason to make the show kid friendly again

This may also mean to tone/scale back the “extreme” decisions XY did (romance, ash-greninja, etc)

XY made Pokémon a more teen/young adult show and there are people out there that want/prefer for Pokemon to be a kid series and dislike anything that can shift it away from that

And the behind-the-scenes people like some writers had “got their way” and got Pokemon back to more kid series in SM which carries on in JN

As for the XY characters and stuff in JN and probably the future

Due to them leaning away from the things that pushed boundaries in XY

They will more than likely never bring up the Serena kiss, and her crush on him may get reduced to being more ambiguous kinda like other crushes that were handled like a Drew or Kenny

Ash-Greninja is complicated but I think (imo) they might regret the actual form not necessarily the power up/bond as the anime did stretch things a bit too far from the games that I wouldn't be surprised if the Pokemon company would want to retcon it

Clemont Bonnie and Korinna were good in their episodes
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