Your Thoughts On Ash Staying In The Anime?

[AuraChannelerChris]

This kid has potential? Huh. You'd fool me after 6 failed regions but trick me with the filler region and the retraux run through Kanto.

 

[Ignition]

Yeah, I know. I might be spoiled with other animes/shows, but I'm still not impressed enough of their attempts to make SM more interesting or the amount of companion spotlights to shine.

Fair enough.

 

[Ignition]

This kid has potential? Huh. You'd fool me after 6 failed regions but trick me with the filler region and the retraux run through Kanto.

Is there anyone you know who's that bad at winning? Imagine what he could do if he joined any team someone wants gone? He's a dedicated failure

 

[AuraChannelerChris]

Is there anyone you know who's that bad at winning?

Misty's Psyduck on a bad day.

Ash's Torkoal.

 

[Ignition]

Misty's Psyduck on a bad day.

Ash's Torkoal.

Fair enough. But did they go to 7 regions and do impressive stuff but fail to win a League each time?

 

[blizzardblaze]

No, since Misty's Psyduck has never been in a league battle, and Torkoal has only been to 2 leagues and has been...eh.

 

[DatsRight]

Granted in any other situation there would be an interesting depth to a protagonist who can actually lose sometimes, just ironically rather than it actually breaking a formula, it's mandated by it. You have to feel bad for Ash since he does constantly exert himself to the point of succeeding in nearly everything else up until that point.

Truthfully I find more investment in a protagonist that has to lose at particular things but still can be effective and successful in other ways over a standard protagonist that always wins. It's hardly through lack of trying either since Ash usually provides the majority of the best battles in the show. I mean technically Serena had the show's best winning streak out of the companions, would you say that meant much?

 

[AznKei]

Granted in any other situation there would be an interesting depth to a protagonist who can actually lose sometimes, just ironically rather than it actually breaking a formula, it's mandated by it. You have to feel bad for Ash since he does constantly exert himself to the point of succeeding in nearly everything else up until that point.

Truthfully I find more investment in a protagonist that has to lose at particular things but still can be effective and successful in other ways over a standard protagonist that always wins. It's hardly through lack of trying either since Ash usually provides the majority of the best battles in the show. I mean technically Serena had the show's best winning streak out of the companions, would you say that meant much?

I would like to see better fighting choreographies with more diverse close range attacks and clever dodging skills and less about staying put while eating powerful projectile attacks. That way, I would care less about who wins or loses since I'll be cheering at the 2 sides. But I doubt they would do something like that in the anime, because somehow they had to make the battles more turn-based like in the mainstream games.

 

[DatsRight]

I would like to see better fighting choreographies with more diverse close range attacks and clever dodging skills and less about staying put while eating powerful projectile attacks. That way, I would care less about who wins or loses since I'll be cheering at the 2 sides. But I doubt they would do something like that in the anime, because somehow they had to make the battles more turn-based like in the mainstream games.

As Brock stated in one episode, a battle should be more about a trainer demonstrating their abilities and personality into how they fight instead of who wins or loses. For that one instance it stuck true, since they managed to make an impressive battle both ways in spite of basically being Steelix stomping Turtonator. A lot of battles in the show however tend to be basic, and in many cases the writers take EVERY AND ANY opportunity to either end them prematurely or reduce them to a curbstomp (and not an entertaining curbstomp like the aforementioned instance, just a dull attack-spam curbstomp that doesn't require any real character agency).

I feel like the writers struggle to write too many well choreographed ones, so save most of the best for Ash's arc battles, which naturally require good the quality the most. The male companions get in the odd good battle when not being worfed or sidelined, while the female companions have went from having occasional good ones (if occasionally gimmick involved like the contests) to rarely ever having a good full battle at all.

BW for example was a series they tried to put in loads of tournaments and even have some of the Team Rocket battles be more effortful and even handed, and many complain the gym/league took a nosedive as a result, they just couldn't keep up a consistent quality for so many episodes. Since then the show's slowly dumbed down the battle count more and more (XY had some great ones but slowly fazed them out increasingly for TR curbstomps or half finished ones, while SM has dumbed down the battle formula altogether despite having the occasional good one).

 

[Leonhart]

but in other ways there's only so much they can do with him at this point

Which could be why they decided to change him slightly in SM to take advantage of his funny side, which we didn't often see in some of the older sagas like DP.

 

[DatsRight]

Which could be why they decided to change him slightly in SM to take advantage of his funny side, which we didn't often see in some of the older sagas like DP.

I don't think it's just he's funnier, he's more versatile in terms of storytelling. He can be put into situations other than battling or sometimes not even using his Pokemon at all and still play into how the story flows along, eg. the Morelull and Passimian episodes are good examples of him using eccentricity to solve the plot. Being quirkier definitely helps to make him hold screentime better than before though, eg. I think he'd struggle in episodes like the desert island one otherwise, having come to rely more and more on exposition or plot devices like Team Rocket prior to SM.

SM is focusing a lot more on charisma and interactions than before, being able to put the cast into any random situation and have it so they can insert enough personality and charm into it to make it distinct and entertaining.

 

[MidnightMelody]

I did not mind it till BW where he was pretty much reset. The ongoing story prior to that was nice and never felt forced like it has for the last 8 years now.

Which could be why they decided to change him slightly in SM to take advantage of his funny side, which we didn't often see in some of the older sagas like DP.

TBH I think it was more the fact GF didn't give them as much to work with so they HAD to try something different even if a lot of people hate it. Trial Captains do nothing in the games and even less in the anime and even if Kahunas are seen as the new gym leaders they reduced the number by half. Not to metion battles in Alola while they do exist are not as extreme as Gens 1-6. The focus is more family and bonds with Pokemon to the point they only just got a league. That and the lack of an actual "evil" team it might have just been too hard for the writers to have done the norm with Gen 7.

I mean I actually expect to go back to the old style (thank god) assuming the games for Gen 8 have the more typical style.

I still stand by my word about wanting Ash to just be replaced for the Gen 8 anime due to it being the first Gen of a home console and entering the era with a new anime would just feel right.

 

[Red and Blue]

I have no idea why people even want a new protagonist. What will he/she bring to the table that Ash doesnt.

They would just have him/her do gym battles with a Pikachu. Might as well keep Ash.

 

[Pokegirl Fan~]

I have no idea why people even want a new protagonist. What will he/she bring to the table that Ash doesnt.

They would just have him/her do gym battles with a Pikachu. Might as well keep Ash.

If the new character is a female I wouldn't mind it especially with the way the female characters have been treated in the last few years when it comes to battling and training Pokemon, since this would force them to actually battle a lot more and also would make them catch more than 3 Pokemon

I agree if the replacement is an Ash clone though (and male)

 

[AznKei]

If the new character is a female I wouldn't mind it especially with the way the female characters have been treated in the last few years when it comes to battling and training Pokemon, since this would force them to actually battle a lot more and also would make them catch more than 3 Pokemon

I agree if the replacement is an Ash clone though (and male)

Yeah, I wouldn't mind if the female protagonist acts like Ash. I would favor more if the show see the boys and girls as equal than the whole "boys battle while the girls cheer" nonsense from the few recent series.

 

[Leonhart]

I still stand by my word about wanting Ash to just be replaced for the Gen 8 anime due to it being the first Gen of a home console and entering the era with a new anime would just feel right.

I personally don't view the Gen VIII era as a milestone since we don't even know much about it other than the era's platform. So I find the idea of Gen VIII influencing Satoshi's departure rather premature.

 

[Platinum fan.]

I don't watch the anime anymore. Part of the reason is Ash fatigue. As someone who was bored with him since DP I hung in there as long as I could but ultimately lost. This is a topic that comes up frequently on Pokemon. Imo Pokemon should have replaced Ash years ago. Either by Hoenn or even Johto. I do agree that if you replace Ash with a character with the same personality trait you'll run into the same problem so only replace him if the main character is going to be different in personality. I personally would have replaced him when they had the chance and they had several to do it.

That being said, it's too late to do it now. Far too late. The anime avoided one problem with replacing a main protagonist in a iconic series but they inadvertently created another one in that the character can be viewed as stale for viewers that stick around for more then one region. The subject of replacing Ash will always be a controversial one among the fanbase. But again it's too late so I reluctantly say keep him. You'll likely never see that female trainer doing Gyms on the anime that fans ask for every now and then but it's a trade off. Go read PokeSpecial for that.

In the end I don't watch the anime anymore so this is no longer my problem. Maybe someday I'll have the endurance to try and watch again. But for now anyway I say keep Ash. If you didn't replace him after getting a region with no Gyms then he's simply not replaceable.

 

[PokemonBattleFanatic-]

Ash should be dropped from the series seeing as he's incapable of consistently rotating his pokemon,capturing powerful pokemon,training his pokemon,pre planning and using strategies for battles all at the same time.

 

[DatsRight]

I struggle to blame a lot of those problems on Ash in particular. Most of the anime cast suffer the same issues only worse (at least Ash they consider game to the show's slapstick and more tense plots and battles, most of the girls they won't even let do anything above a curbstomp battle for their quota these days). Inserting another protagonist would likely make it no better since the writers obviously have a set way in how they develop plot and characters.