Zoroark & Gengar (Future Uber tier?)

[Arsène]

Are you talking from experience or from theory? Zoroark makes a terrible Swords Dancer. It has far less damage potential than Weavile and it even has worse defenses. STAB Sucker Punch isn't a joke but it is highly predictable and easy to work around.

Do you think I just type random nonsense from my keyboard? This is obviously experience. Illusion does work, even with team preview. Also, the Sucker Punch "predictablility" (lol.), something's going to be dented or KO'd when executed correctly, like it or not.

Its UU / LU because people don't use it. Its not banned from either tier either because Zoroark isn't very good lol.

People naturally wouldn't use something that actually requires thought to use properly. But that's your opinion; which most certainly doesn't make it correct.

 

[Blue Harvest]

Do you think I just type random nonsense from my keyboard? This is obviously experience. Illusion does work, even with team preview. Also, the Sucker Punch "predictablility" (lol.), something's going to be dented or KO'd when executed correctly, like it or not.

More like slightly dented, because no good player will be surprised by Sucker Punch. If a Zoroark Swords Dances as I switch in my Starmie (example) I'm not going to leave it in, I'm going to switch to Scizor, or Substitute Garchomp, or anything that can either survive a hit or avoid it entirely.

People naturally wouldn't use something that actually requires thought to use properly. But that's your opinion; which most certainly doesn't make it correct.

Hmm, so now you're trying to insult the intelligence of everyone who used Zoroark, and realized its dead weight most of the time.

How high have you been on the ladder? What is your Zoroark cloaked as? What set do you use?

 

[Arsène]

More like slightly dented, because no good player will be surprised by Sucker Punch. If a Zoroark Swords Dances as I switch in my Starmie (example) I'm not going to leave it in, I'm going to switch to Scizor, or Substitute Garchomp, or anything that can either survive a hit or avoid it entirely.

Do elaborate on how do you plan to predict a Sucker Punch in an illusion. I want whatever goggles you're using in battles to be able to tell the exact moment Zoroark is on the field. Otherwise everything else you've said is out of the window at this point.

Hmm, so now you're trying to insult the intelligence of everyone who used Zoroark, and realized its dead weight most of the time.

How high have you been on the ladder? What is your Zoroark cloaked as? What set do you use?

You sure love putting words in my mouth. If that qualifies as an "insult", I guess I must have been born yesterday. But it's okay --your word is apparently the voice of everyone's.

I don't do any "laddering" in OU for PO besides random matches if I'm looking to test a Pokemon's usability in that tier. I only ladder in Gen 5/Dream World Ubers (PokeBattleCenter, mainly) as OU in it's current state is Excadrill, Tar, Gliscor, Chomp; rinse and repeat. Generic and devoid of any life whatsoever.

My Zoroark assumes the guise of most Pokemon who wouldn't be immune/affected by common entry hazards. Although, I usually end up doing that anyway, forcing me to keep a spinner like Forretress or Starmie available. It also prefers to find a safe switch-in on something in Illusion to scare them off.

Usually running a build of:

Naive nature @Life Orb
40 Atk/218 SpA/252 Speed.
~Sucker Punch
~Flamethrower
~U-turn
~Swords Dance

Or, works as a revenge killer/scout as well if I'm scarfed:

Timid/Naive nature @Choice Scarf
4 HP/4 Atk, 252 SpA, 252 Speed
Flamethrower
Dark Pulse/Night Daze
Hidden Power Ice/Focus Blast
Grass Knot/U-turn (if Naive)

Most of the time it's disguised as Garchomp (if using the first set) - sandstorm/SR blows the disguise; usually resulting in a U-turn to get of the way. But in the clear, roasting their lovely Steel-type counters on the switch with Flamethrower always feels good. Forretress/Starmie are preferred partners to keep impending hazards out of the way. But with the weather wars lately, it's becoming a nuisance if Sandstorm is up.

But, I'm experimenting with more partners who wouldn't seem too out of place on OU teams. Toxicroak, Heracross, Infernape (if I'm leading), Scizor, Jellicent and many others I've tried to some extent. Team Preview might seem like a boon, but I love the paranoia it could cause once they see a Zoroark in the team and a well-known partner of it at the same time - only to figure out it's not necessarily my intention.

 

[kaiser soze]

I don't think i've ever faced a legitimately good opponent who's used a Zoroark since the very beginning of BW.

I think I've seen mostly 10-year olds just using it with haxorus and their starter. I spot them doing random matchup rotational matchups and they never rotate

 

[ITG_321]

If Team Preview didn't exist, Zoroark would be a lot more useful. The jig is pretty much up when the match starts and a smart opponent can easily tell which is the illusion once it attacks.

 

[Zachmac]

I've been using a Zoroark/Gengar combo, and it's not going to Ubers anytime soon. If fact, it's not even going there at all. Zoroark is fun to use, but 105 speed isn't good enough. The new Fighting and Flying trios, for example, outrun it. It falls to priority, too. Sure, it can hit scizor with flamethrower, but scizor would use Bullet punch on gengar too. Neither of them can really heart Chancy, even with focus blast, which, by the way, is inaccurate. Also, if you want a swords dance+suckerpunch, use absol, for much higher attack and super luck to stack on night slash.

This is not definitely not going to Ubers. In fact, it won't be able to scratch Ubers.

If Team Preview didn't exist, Zoroark would be a lot more useful. The jig is pretty much up when the match starts and a smart opponent can easily tell which is the illusion once it attacks.

People usually fall for it when I do it...

 

[ITG_321]

I've been using a Zoroark/Gengar combo, and it's not going to Ubers anytime soon. If fact, it's not even going there at all. Zoroark is fun to use, but 105 speed isn't good enough. The new Fighting and Flying trios, for example, outrun it. It falls to priority, too. Sure, it can hit scizor with flamethrower, but scizor would use Bullet punch on gengar too. Neither of them can really heart Chancy, even with focus blast, which, by the way, is inaccurate. Also, if you want a swords dance+suckerpunch, use absol, for much higher attack and super luck to stack on night slash.

This is not definitely not going to Ubers. In fact, it won't be able to scratch Ubers. People usually fall for it when I do it...

Mostly on the first turn, but once they see Gengar using Dark Pulse or a Psychic attack not doing anything, it'll be obvious. Plus, the illusion only works till Zoroark gets hit, right?
Edit: I suppose it can work if Zoroark uses a move Gengar also has like Focus Blast/Hidden Power.

 

[Zachmac]

Mostly on the first turn, but once they see Gengar using Dark Pulse or a Psychic attack not doing anything, it'll be obvious. Plus, the illusion only works till Zoroark gets hit, right?

But it also gives zoroark a chance to use Agility/Nasty Plot.

I'm still on the side that it shouldn't be Uber though.

 

[Arsène]

It's pretty much a given it won't be Uber. Especially if it happens to be in an illusion of something which activates it's ability on sight --a dead giveaway.

Nothing's stopping the OP from using it in Ubers, just don't expect to get far. I'd rather use a Darkrai instead, though.