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Attack Heresies

Headshot-Jackal465

The Kwisatz Haderach
This thread is for attack changes and such. Also point-out weird things of attacks that make no sense.

It is my list of attack heresies--ideas I have to change attack movesets, type, the works. It may be herecy to publish them, but I have my opinions. If you disagree, that's fine. Just post here and explain. Also, post your own herecies here as they pwertain to attacks.


First of all, why is there no attack called "Punch" or "Kick"? Its basic! First you can punch, later you learn how to mega punch or fire punch, but punch is a basic thing that anything with fists should be able to know how to do. I mean, Bite eventually is 1-upped by Crunch, but there is no building block for mega punch. Same with Mega Kick. "kick" and "punch" are basic attacks just like scratch and tackle. How come they were never created? You have karate chop and a billion other kinds of punches, but no "punch".

And what about the total lack of bug attacks? There are, like, 3 good ones and fury cutter. Fury cutter isn't something to say "wow" at. Silver wind is great, signal beam and megahorn are too, but very few pokemon can learn any of these moves naturally. If the bug type is to be given any credibility at all, there must be additions. The ability, "Swarm" is useless if there aren't any bug techniques to support it.

I once said before that one of these additions to the bug-type should be cut. The reasoning behind this is clear. First of all, it destroys plants outside of battle, the only types which are super-effective against plants are flying, fire, bug, ice types. Bug is the only type of these which makes sense to change the tyope to. Normal type is for attacks and pokemon which do not fit into any other category better. Bug is a better fit for bug than anything else. Secondly, Fury cutter is bug, why can't cut be bug? There is a drought of bug attacks now and adding cut to the list would be a big help to the entire bug-catching community. Right now, Bug pokemon are being dominated by the fact that they have a limited attack base. They may be super-effective towards psy, grass, and dark, but without the moves to support this, they are sunk. Cut being a bug technique like fury cutter could greatly increase its chances of being a contending type for battlers.

And the lack of powerful poison techniques continues to be a hinderence to poison types. There is sludge and sludgebomb--poison fang is descent also, but pokemon like arbok and seviper cannot naturally learn sludge, which is more of an attack for the gaseous weezing and fluid grimer. More powerful poison attacks for the snake and plant (victreebell) pokemon would greatly increase the credibility of carrying poison pokemon, Currently, poison types are overlooked due to their general weaknesses. Having better, more powerful attacks would greatly aid them.

Ghost as a physical attack. Not a bad concept, but hear me out. Gengar has a huge potential as a special attack sweeper due to its big sp atk. My own Haunter level 51, adamant nature has a sp attack of over 170 currently and Im proud of it. However, its attack power is very small, so its ghost attacks are weak. I don't know how to fix this, but something should be done--Gengar gets no STAB at all if you use attacks that take advantage of its high sp atk. Filling it up with Psychic and Thunderbolt and such does not fill the void left by its inability to wield ghost attacks or even poison attacks as it rightfully should. However, it should not stop being so powerful as a sp atk sweeper. It truly is a paradox.

Hypno should learn Dream Eater by leveling-up. 'Nuf said.

Dream Eater as a psychic attack. It should be ghost since the first pokemon to utilize the move were the gastly line. It also has a more spiritual base since its about sucking the foe's "soul" (dream, whatever) out. It is the attack described when dex entries talk about stealing foe's souls. It is better suited towards the nightly presence of ghost pokemon than the intellectual, spoon bending psychics.

The inaccuracy of rock attacks. There is currently one 100% accurate rock attack, ancient power. That is one out of 6 (not counting sandstorm). Clearly, the rock-wielders are being short-changed just like the bug-wielders in that the reliable move base is slim. Inaccuracy is what makes attacks like Fireblast less effective than flamethrower--an attack with more PP, 100 accuracy and still high damage. Even "Rock throw" has a 90% accuracy and its a weaker attack. Rock types are being gypped.

Heat Wave is a useless attack. Lets compare Heat Wave with Flamethrower:
Format:ATTACK-power-accuracy-PP-effect-TYPE

HEAT WAVE-100-90-10-10% burn-FIRE
FLAMETHROWER-95-100-15-10% burn-FIRE

Heat wave adds 5 to attack power, but subtracts 10 from accuracy and 5 from PP. Such detriment with such a small increase is useless in my book. Flamethrower is undoubtedly the better move as its 10% more accurate and you may use it 50% more often than heat wave with only a 5.263% increase in power. Heat Wave should be removed from the list of attacks.
 
1. Pound and low kick could be called basic kick and punch moves. There's no need for "punch" and "kick" as they'll basically be the same.

2. Think about it. Bugs are generally weak, and in real life there's not really much bugs can do. In fact, bugs got more than they should have. Logically, megahorn and fury cutter should be normal and silver wind should be flying, but they turned out as bug moves.

3. IMO the bug type was a mistake. There's barely anything that could be done with it, and all bugs should have been normal types in the first place. Come on, what IS the bug type? Exactly what the name suggests...just bugs. Do you see any bird type? Fish type? Reptile type?

4. True. Poison needs more benefits.

5. Can't really say anything about the ghost thing. I'd rather that it stayed as physical though.

6. It doesn't?

7. True...but can you imagine throwing rocks at someone to be 100% accurate?

8. There are many attacks like that. It just adds more choice. Some people may prefer power over accuracy.
 
bugs are overlooked there is plenty gamefreak can do with them if they think hard enough.
like a plague attack or even go as far as an attack soley based on the fear of bugs.(creepy crawly you know)
 
Gengar@Choice Band
252 Atk/252 Spd/6 HP
Adamant Nature
Levitate
Sludge Bomb
Shadow Ball
Focus Punch
Explosion

It actually works pretty well, but I see what you're saying about Gengar's Attack as opposed to its Special Attack. It's better than it was in the olden days where even though Poison (and I think Ghost) was a Special type, Ghost attacks did not affect Psychic types at all. O_o

Double Team is a travesty of an attack. :(
 
I agree, Bug-types need alot of good moves to make up for the start. The only damaging Bug-type move in RBY was Twineedle. O.o At least make a decent Bug-move a TM or something, so most PKMN cn benefit from it.

Sludge Bomb for Poison types is a great move, but the only one. It looks like Doripions Cross Poison is a good move, but we'll have to wait and see.
 
In my opinion Xatu (Which is quickly ascending to the higher reaches of my favorites list) needs to learn Destiny Bond as it seems like it would learn it... come on, Qwilfish, Cacturne, and Weezing can learn it so why can't Xatu?
~;354;
 
True. There and why deny Xatu and give it to Qwilfish? Its better suited for Xatu.

Responding to Moonlight:
1: Touche, but you catch my point, right?
2: Normal type is a type for attacks/pokemon that don't belong somewhere better. My money is on GM creating those attacks because they wish to boost the bug type. What they did was meagar and more has to be done.
3:And rock type is only rocks and grass type is only plants. Your point? Bugs don't belong in any other tpyes besides bug. There has been bug type since the first game, why would they remove it? If you wanna take out bug type, why not remove rock type too? It pretty much walks hand-in-hand with ground and is the same idea, eh? And then, why not remove ice? Its just cold water, right? Make all the ice types water types. I dont think bug type should be done-away with just because it is exclusive rather than inclusive like water type. You are right though, it is exclusive, but I dont think it should be removed because of this.
6: http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-rs/097.shtml It doesn't learn it by leveling-up like haunter does.
7: Touche, but neither is shooting water (watergun) and throwing sand or mud (sandattack/mudslap). I think you're right though but I still think that more rock attacks should come with better accuracy. I remember playing through the elite four in johto with sudowoodo and holding my breath every time I used rockslide, hoping it would find its mark.
8: True, but the power increase is so negligable that its useless. I understand if people prefer blizzard over ice beam or fire blast over flamethrower, but heatwave is something else alltogether.



Flying should be super-effective against ground (high ground wins), but then, sincve most rock types are also ground, that would ruin their efectiveness towards flying. In light of this, flying shouldn't be super-effective against ground.

Dunsparce's ability should be run away. It says in its pokedex entry that it runs away from battle. 'Nuf said. It should also at least learn poison sting and dig by leveling-up.

All steel attacks have less than 100% accuracy. There should be more reliable steel attacks out there.

Doom Desire should not be a steel attack. The description says, "Summons strong sunlight to attack two turns later." Read "fire". True, in this content, it is a solar attack that referrs to space and stuff. Steel=meteorites and jirachi's a meteorite, thus its steel summons the sun through some cosmic whatever it dioes. I understand why its a steel attack, but it really is more of a fire technique.

Vine Whip should have more PP than 10. Its power is 35 and no additional effects. Scratch does 40 power with 35 PP. Flamethrower has 95 power with 15 PP. Why is vine whip so low in PP? it is totally illogical.
 
I think that all Dark moves should become Physical, for example, Crunch and Bite are touching the opponent, while Ghost moves should become Special, for example, Shadow Ball conjures up a ball of energy to attack.
 
^I agree with Ghost becoming Special, but what about its moves lick Lick? Also, I think Dark is special since most of its non-damaging moves like Torment aren't physical. With Crunch, I imagined it as porjecting teeth to a larger size, then bringing them down on a foe.
 
Vine Whip should have more PP than 10
So true...I never got why they did that. It's not like Vine Whip's such an important move anyway, but I tend to run out of PP a lot whenever I train a Bulbasaur. Pretty annoying.
 
Moonlight. said:
IMO the bug type was a mistake. There's barely anything that could be done with it, and all bugs should have been normal types in the first place. Come on, what IS the bug type? Exactly what the name suggests...just bugs. Do you see any bird type? Fish type? Reptile type?
Bug was a mistake. They have no common STAB-able move. The ONLY useable one is Heracross. Bug type in general is just a vunerable and neglected type. I'm tired of these awesome designs but god awful stats. Ariados is a spider with the speed of a snail. Pinsir is a bug without any bug moves to use, so dead. Beedrill will die in one hit. You get the point.

Why does Water Jet and Water Gun exist together? Water Jet is a Water type Quick Attack... They might as well came up with a Bug type move...
 
Leon Phelps said:
Bug was a mistake. They have no common STAB-able move. The ONLY useable one is Heracross. Bug type in general is just a vunerable and neglected type. I'm tired of these awesome designs but god awful stats. Ariados is a spider with the speed of a snail. Pinsir is a bug without any bug moves to use, so dead. Beedrill will die in one hit. You get the point.

Why does Water Jet and Water Gun exist together? Water Jet is a Water type Quick Attack... They might as well came up with a Bug type move...
The thing is, there aren't many moves that could truly be called a bug move. What do bugs do that could be made into a move? I can't think of much...
 
well a good bug move would maybe be WEST NILE or perhaps MALARIA that damages the foe and if you withdraw it infects the rest of ur team. honestly, the bug type has so much potential like poison poison just needs to lose its psychic weakness

but no really i agree with nearly everything thats been said cept the getting rid of bug type, its there for balance, also the sp atk/atk switch off with dark and ghost is there for balance however logical it is.
and someone mentioned something bout dunsparce getting moves because the poke dex said so:
USING/TRUSTING THE POKE'DEX FOR ANYTHING OTHER THAN FINDING POKEMON IS STUPID. the game designers r sitting in there chairs laughing at the little kid down on the street crying because his ledian didnt learn moonlight even tho the pokedex said that ledian uses the stars for energy or sableye isn't good against rock types because the pokedex says it eats rocks
 
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